Debate rages at 11th hour

| 13/07/2012

ezz omov (229x300).jpg(CNS):  Less than one week before voters will go to the polls to decide on how they will vote at the next general election, members of the UDP government were themselves debating the pros and cons of the existing multi-member system with the idea of a national vote or other methods. As the OMOV campaigners focused entirely on the equality and accountability of one man, one vote during an open public debate at the Harquail Theatre, Education Minister Rolston Anglin said that the country needed far more discussion about what was the most suitable voting system for Cayman, while his colleague Ellio Solomon argued for a national poll.

As the indecision in the United Democratic Party ranks became apparent, local attorney Wayne Panton, North Side MLA Ezzard Miller and Chamber of Commerce President David Kirkaldy were solid in their support for equality in the voting system. Panton, who will run as a PPM candidate in the next elections, said that the Caymanian people would see on Referendum Day the need to vote for OMOV as they would recognise that all Caymanians are equal and that everyone should have one vote and equal representation.

Illustrating the debate still raging in the UDP and in contrast to the premier’s position of retaining the status quo of multi-member constituencies, backbench MLA Ellio Solomon made it clear that he supported a national poll. He appeared to have some support from Anglin, his front bench colleague, whose position was that more debate was needed. He said the goal of any election system should be for candidates to attract the broadest possible support from the electorate in order to be returned rather than less, as he claimed would be the case with single member constituencies.

In a debate that could have continued into the early hours, the five panel members at the Generation Now event, which took place on Thursday evening and was broadcast on Radio Cayman, saw Miller, Panton and Kirkaldy unified on the position that one man, one vote and single member constituencies would give Cayman a more equitable and democratic system with more accountable representation.

Meanwhile, the two UDP candidates, while arguing againstone man, one vote and single member constituencies, were not wholeheartedly supporting the status quo and made it clear that they saw a need for change in the country’s voting system.

Anglin said that there needed to be a much wider debate and assessment of the possible systems which could suit the Cayman Islands but failed to define exactly what he thought was the most successful way. Solomon, on the other hand, advocated his position that in a small country such as Cayman everyone could have 18 votes and elect the entire government.

“We need the right model for our small economy,” said Anglin but did not indicate exactly what he believed that would be.

Solomon said the idea of a national poll was resonating with the voters but he could not explain why government had not offered that option on the referendum. Howeveer, he said he would be “proud” to petition for it after the referendum.

Anglin said that there had not been enough debate on the subject and criticised the OMOV campaign for not coming to government and suggesting a debate on all the issues.

“There has been no debate about how we want to create a voting system,” he said as he emphasised the need to find a system that could attract the broadest base. “We need a continuing dialogue about the appropriate system for Cayman.”

However, the OMOV supporters suggested the national vote idea was merely muddying the waters as the simplest and clearest voting system was one man, one vote in single member constituencies.

Ezzard Miller, who spearheaded the OMOV campaign, pointed out that he had made several attempts to introduce a debate to the Legislative Assembly about the voting system since he was elected in 2009 but also pointed to the historic failure of governments since the 1990s to ignore the growing support across the country for OMOV.

With poll after poll indicating a support of over 80% in favour, he said, it was time to introduce the system. It was also made clear that while the referendum may not carry because of the government’s imposition of a legal require of more than 50% of the electorate rather than the turnout, if the majority of voters who turned out voted in favour this would still be a telling result that the government should still heed.

Category: Politics

Comments (205)

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  1. Anonymous says:

    UDP supporters are saying that OMOV promotes division but what about themselves.Aren't they trying to divide us by rich or poor class by suggesting that when Mr Panton spoke about OMOV helping  voters in selecting the right kind of individual to be MLAs, that he was was against the "kind" of people like McKeeva and Julie who came from poor backgrounds?Is that what I heard when listening to the broadcast of the UDP meeting in Cayman Brac on Saturday night when Rolston was speaking? Please someone correct me if I heard wrong.Please say it isn't so.  I believe that most of us knew that Wayne was speaking about ; the kind of people who would respect all the checks and balances in the Govt procurement system,and not give away a large  portion of Govt Revenue along with a stretch of West Bay Road to just one developer,. or not accuse the Auditor General for simply doing his job,or ignore the wishes of the people.To twist this to say that he was against poor people getting elected would be gross injustice and MOST DIVISIVE.                                                                                                                                                 If someone taped this broadcast ,could they please listen to it again and correct me if I am wrong.

  2. Anonymous says:

    Are the stars of the anti-OMOV ads being paid to do them? XXXX I know that the stars of the Alliance for Cayman ads ARE being paid. 

  3. Anonymous says:

    I some how like the OMOV system, this forms the basis for any country’s electoral census. In other jurisdictions, when there is a large voter turnout, the Democratic Party wins and if there is a low turnout, the labour Party wins. Political scientists use this system to predict the polls. Some politicians are made to fight for their place, instead of the old guard or recycling of politicians and favoritism.

  4. Anonymous says:

    Foolio was so busy being angry that he referred to one of the audience members who asked a question as "caller"!

    LOL – must have been a flashback to his Rooster days!

  5. Anonymous says:

    Listening to the UDP "educate" (more like campaign) left me feeling sick! All they have educated anyone on is how to be divisive, how to holler at others, how NOT to behave!

    And for the "values" they represent….i'll be voting yes!

    One of many who are sick and tired of the sell out and horse $h!T by UDP

    Their plan clearly is to enrich themselves and a few of "their" supporters and leave the majority of us and our children to pay the massive debts because they gave away Cayman's assetts and revenues.

  6. Anonymous says:

    There is no need for all this blarney about the need or lack thereof for OMOV, SMC or a NAtional Vote. We keep recycling the old politicians anyway- so does one really think that OMOV will get rid of Mckeeva, Kurt, Alden, Rolston or whoever? It WONT. The 'block-vote' has always determined the outcome of an election in Cayman and will continue to do so with or without OMOV. What we need is TERM LIMITS- if yo0u cannot prove yourself after 8 years then you simply arent worthy of OMOV or any kind of votes. I say 2 four year terms and you must step aside to allow new flesh and new faces.

  7. Libertarian says:

    @ Dred – I never will rule out voting "yes" to the one person one vote single member constituency. We have came this far and referendum just one day away. Why vote "no" now when it will regress us back into a worse state of affairs. I agree with everything you said. Under the one person one vote, you will see three pillars:  VOTER EQUALITY, MLA ACCOUNTABIITY, and definitely MORE REPRESENTATION (for district minorities).  And yes, you will not have the rule of the majority, excluding the Sister Islands and Outer districts, as you would see in a National Vote advocated by the UDP party. 

    But do not feel that the one person one vote single member constituency system, is the best for us. If it is passed on the 18 of July, I think we should consider reevaluating the one person one vote system. Have a special independent commission with the task of exploring the worldwide electoral systems and which system would be conducive to the Cayman Islands. Why?  Because with the one person one vote system, if I don't want to see a candidate become an MLA in another district from mine, because he/she is a bad apple, what choice do I have to prevent this from happening?  Suppose that candidate becomes the Premier, then what???  Under the one person one vote system, my hands would be tied to one vote for the candidate ONLY in my particular district. This disenfranchises the voter from having enough choices in shaping the government he/she wants to see. I believe from the start, they should have really pushed for the one person two votes, meaning each person would be able to vote for their particular district MLA and have another vote on hand to vote for who they would like to see Premier. That way, the people as a whole would have direct say in also being able to recall or remove the Premier from office if they lost confidence in him. So whereas not having the one person one vote system, disenfranchises district minorities – having it will also disenfranchise voters as a whole in seeing who forms and leads government. So the one person one vote is not a PERFECT system and my fear is, because it is politically motivated as well by Ezzard, because it would be to his advantage as well, it may remain with no appeal for improvement. A special commission is necessary to having a nonpartisan one-sided approach on the most conducive electoral system for these islands.

    What is Ezzard saying and the proponents behind the one person one vote saying that will ensure to us that after this is pass, they will move forward for more democratic reforms, such as ALLOWING THE PEOPLE TO HAVE THE POWER TO RECALL OR REMOVE THE PREMIER DIRECTLY. People should have more involvement with not just voting for their district MLA; they should have that right to vote as well for their leader – everyone should have that right. What will be assured to the public when the one person one vote is pass that this will be.

    VOTING "YES" – VOTING "NO" FOR ONE PERSON ONE VOTE, IS NOT MY CONCERN, DRED, IT IS WHERE WE WILL GO FROM THIS POINT OF TIME.

    Regards

    • Dred says:

      Libertarian…

      Out of MMC and SMC it is the best. It is not meant to be an END ALL but a STEP in the right direction.

      No one has said that this is where everything stops but it is the first evolutionary step.

      What we need to do is to first take this step and then re-evaluate how it can be improved upon. BUT This step needs to be taken and NOW.

      On July 18th vote YES for OMOV.

      • Libertarian says:

        If itis passed, I believe it may put us into a worse situation than we are in now, because of two things:  1. We will be divided more into smaller districts, most of the population losing their many votes; and 2. How do we know the future that improvements to the system will ever be made by a government we can't trust?  It would be casting a vote out of blind faith that re-evaluation of the electoral system will be made. Is it worth betting or getting it right?

    • Dred says:

      Because with the one person one vote system, if I don't want to see a candidate become an MLA in another district from mine, because he/she is a bad apple, what choice do I have to prevent this from happening? 

      Ask me this. What choice do you have now? What if you did not like the East End or North Side candidate what choice do you have now? Let me answer that for you. NONE.

      Under the one person one vote system, my hands would be tied to one vote for the candidate ONLY in my particular district. This disenfranchises the voter from having enough choices in shaping the government he/she wants to see.

      You know if you continue this I am going to start to think you are not as bright as I first thought you to be. This is called VOTER EQUALITY. Where EACH voter has ONE VOTE. You have JUST AS MUCH POWER to shape the government as anyone else.

      If you are trying to bring up National Vote forget it. It is too party oriented and will take us back into the dark ages.

      While I can see some credence in voting for a Premier also what you are failing to grasp is this is not what is available to us. You are looking to create perfection is a step and the fact remains no matter what you throw upthere will always be a wrinkle or two in it.

      NO SYSTEM IS PERFECT BUT this is the better of the two systems.

      Once we get OMOV then maybe we can re-examine how we can fine tune it. But we need to take the first step. That first step is OMOV and people should vote YES to OMOV on July 18th 2012. 

      Libertarian you need to stop trying to jump and realise two steps = 1 jump and it's much harder to jump than to take 2 steps in a political process. 

    • Knot S Smart says:

      Libertarian. I know how you can rebuild your credibility. First think of one sentence that sums up your point – then post that sentence.

      When you jumble up 849 words as you usually do – it leaves the rest of us wondering:

      WTF is he trying to say?

  8. FUZZY says:

    At the UDP meeting in Cayman Brac on Saturday night ( 14th July) it was really interesting the way Elio presented it to his Brac audience.Let's just say he took certain liberties with the truth.In other words had he been in court he would be guilty of not telling the "whole truth".He told Braccers that it would be a good thing for them to have a say in who was elected in George Town and left it at that .HE FAILED TO TELL THEM THE WHOLE TRUTH THAT GEORGE TOWNERS AS WELL AS VOTERS FROM ALL THE OTHER DISTRICTS WOULD BE CHOOSING THE REPRESENTATIVE FOR THE BRAC.THATS RIGHT,IF AS LITTLE AS  1200 VOTERS FROM GRAND CAYMAN VOTED FOR TWO CANDIDATES OTHER THAN THE TWO PEOPLE DESIRED BY CAYMAN BRAC VOTERS ,THEN GRAND CAYMAN VOTERS AND NOT CAYMAN BRAC VOTERS WOULD END UP CHOOSING THE BRAC MLAs EVEN IF EVERY SINGLE BRAC VOTER HAD VOTED FOR THE SAME CANDIDATES.The same is true for North Side and East End .YOUR MLA WOULD BE CHOSEN BY THE DISTRICTS HAVING THE HIGHEST AMOUNT OF VOTERS In other words;North Side and East End  each have about 600 voters out of over 15000 registered voters ,so guess who loses in a head to head fight.This national vote thing would be used simply to foce the will of the larger districts upon the smaller ones.THIS MEANS THAT A MLA ELECTED OR ASSIGNED TO REPRESENT ONE OF THESE SMALLER DISTRICTS CAN GET AWAY WITH DOING ABSOLUTELY NOTHING FOR THAT DISTRICT,HAVE EVERY SINGLE REGISTERED VOTER WANT HIM OUT AND VOTE AGAINST HIM  AND HE COULD STILL GET RE-ELECTED IF THE VOTERS IN THE LARGER  DISTRICTS WANT HIM.So the next time that Elio starts this conversation just ask him to tell the you this part of the story.This ideaof a National vote is being put out there to get you to vote no and for no other reason.After the referendum, if the OMOV people are defeated ,you can bet that the UDP will not be pushing for a national vote anytime soon ;they simply will not be able to sell it to the Cayman Brac voters and they need that Brac vote .After Miss Julie retires that might be a different matter ,but not before.If you are thinking about voting no because you want to hear more about the national vote ;FORGET IT.

  9. Anonymous says:

    When I see one WB MLA standing at the end of "his" road, three o'clock in the afternon on a  weekday, in his white shorts, hand on kimba, looking up in the sky… I am voting Yes!! on Wednesday and you should too. Cos if we had OMOV he or anyone else wouldn't have time for that. He'd sure be working for us.

    I think some of these constituents, in WB for sure, work harder to get them elected and campaigning against OMOV than the MLAs do representing us. Who are we paying good money to – and for what?

    Like Bob Marley say, 'One Love, One Heart.' I say, "One Man, One Vote!"

    • one point of view says:

      The accountablity arguement for OMOV is insulting. What are our elected official now ?

      This issue seems more about politics and creating "voting blocks" that will possibly allow others to win a seat and the governement.

      It is the majority vote that allows the governement to be in power, it's the majority vote that allows the ministers to choose who gets what ministry.

      So if that is the whole point to this election thing, then why  are we fighting the system ?

      Equality ?  How about Proportional ? (small groups have small input, large groups large input)

      How about if we vote on no campaigning until six months before elections ?

      or that all ministers be assigned to a ministry ? Thatthey too have to accept the majority decision of the other ministers. 

      Enough Discussion…get to work !!!

       

       

       

       

      • Dred says:

        What a pile of nonsensicle dribble.

        "What are our elected officials now?" – Not accountable that's for sure. No one truly knows who is doing stuff and who's just towing the party line. We have people who BARELY keep a seat warm.

        Thsi is about equality. I mean we say it over and over to you but you are so dense it seems to be struggling to sink in.

        Let me tell you the name again see if this helps.

        ONE MAN ONE VOTE

        Notice I did not say Vote for any person be it party or indepent, I simply said ONE PERSON ONE VOTE.

        In other words no matter where you live beit West Bay, Goerge Town or East End you get wait for it….

        ONE VOTE

        This makes you and me EQUAL. So this is about EQUALITY.

        On July 18th VOTE YES to OMOV

    • Anonymous says:

      What does "hand on kimba" mean?

      • Rorschach says:

        What I believe the poster meant to write was, "Hands AKIMBO" meaning standing with your hands on your hips and feet slightly apart..

      • Anonymous says:

        it means both hands on hips.  

      • Knot S Smart says:

        Yea… What would the Lion King say if he knew our MLA was caressing Kimba?

  10. SKEPTICAL says:

    Somebody has raised the issue of their Father’s name not being removed from the Voter Registration List even though the gentleman has been dead for some years. As the poster pointed out, if the the list is not completely up to date, it could distort the number needed in a “Referendum” vote to qualify as a a winning YES vote. Perhaps new Voter Registration cards should have been issued for what is a VERY important ballot.

    • Anonymous says:

      I agree, anyone who has passed away recently and there has not been time to remove them from the voters list will automatically be a NO vote. This is so unfair. I am voting YES just to show this Government that I don't agree with the way they do things and I am DISGUSTED that they are spending our money to campaign against their own referendum. 

    • Anonymous says:

      If one deceased voter is counted as a "NO VOTE" the election results will be contested in the Courts. I will make sure of that.

  11. Moby's Dick says:

    It doesn’t matter how you elect your puppets – you need different people to run your government. There isn’t a real leader anywhere in sight of your political system.

  12. Anonymous says:

    I don’t understand the argument that single member constituiencies will bring division. What have the existing electoral boundaries done to divide us to date?? Nothing! Even within districts there is already natural division and there is nothing wrong with that. From the beginning of time East Enders differentiate between east end and gun bay, for example. Towners differentiate between sports and prospect. Bodden towers differentiate between Bodden town, breakers, Pedro, lower valley, etc. and there is nothing wrong with that. It is natural for people to break themselves into small groups of people that have something in common. This ” unity” argument is utopia.

    Division happens in schools and classrooms from we are children so this argument that cayman I too small for division is garbage. Just like at school or even in the work place, most effective work is done when people are divided with specific responsibilities. Going forward we the constituents will make up the team and we will each have our own leader! Just like in school we feed our views thru them and they take it to the LA to represent our interests.

  13. Dennie Warren Jr. says:

    Re: ““We need the right model for our small economy,” said Anglin but did not indicate exactly what he believed that would be.”

    One person one vote is a good first step, because it specifically addresses voter equality at the ballot box.  Regardless of the other ways in which the current electoral system could be changed, one person one vote will still be a necessary part of any democratic voting system.

    Whether a voter has four votes (WB & GT), three votes (BT), two votes (CB & LC), one vote (NS & EE), or zero votes as the Caymanian women did prior to 1959, each of those circumstances are just different degrees of discrimination.

    None of us should be desiring to have an unfair advantage over any another voter at the ballot box.  I’m proud to be standing on the shoulders of all those great men and women prior to 1959 who fought for the right of women to vote at General Elections, and on July 18, 2012 will be our time to reach for a new height.  Not only should women to have the right to vote, but it is long overdue for male and female voters to all have equal voting rights. On July 18, 2012 I will be voting, yes, for voter equality.
     

    • Anon says:

      But aren’t Voters in the Brac and Little Cayman still going to have 2 votes under ‘OMOV’?

      • Anonymous says:

        No, not if the petition is passed. Even under the PPM plan they would have one vote but it would be a two member constituency.

        • Dred says:

          Simply put the top two vote getters will get in. But each person has one vote.

  14. Anonymous says:

    If not for Ezzard and Arden the only mouths we would hear is that of the Dicktator and Foolio.  Ezzard and Arden are the only MLA's who are concerned about ALL of Cayman, not just their own districts, that is why if not for them we would never know about all the XXXXX unconstitutional dealings of the West Bay Mob and their lame a$$ a$$ociates.  What better representation could you ask for in our LA and what more proof does anyone need that OMOV and SMC is our answer?   Stand up for change.  Stand up for what is right.  Be a part of the SOLUTION that we need NOW………………..Come out one and all in solidarity for Cayman and Vote    Y E S     on Wed. July 18th!!!!

  15. Kent McTaggart says:

    MMC accountability at work

    Date:       July 12, 2012

    The below is an actual conversation between Kent McTaggart and Ellio Solomon, which took place at the Harquail Theater 7/12/2012 at the Generation NOW sponsored OMOV/SMC debate.

     

    The George Town District Counsel applications were forwarded to the government via Minister Mike Adams well over 6 months ago.  To be considered for a place on the counsel, Kent McTaggart among others submitted the appropriate application and other required paperwork within the deadline set by the government. Since then the question of what is happening with the formation of it has been a question asked and unanswered on many occasions through different channels over the months.  Kent finally posed the question to Minister Ellio Solomon via phone conversation on air during a local radio show approximately 6 weeks before the below conversation took place.

     

    Setting:  Kent walks up to Ellio in the open area in the foyer of the theater by a stair case.  There are just a couple other people in the area and Kent proceeds to ask a question face to face.

    Conversation:

    Kent)       Ellio, Hey what is going on with the George Town district counsel?

    Ellio)        What do you mean?

    Kent)       Remember I called in on the Radio and asked you about them well over 4 weeks ago?

    Ellio)        Yea I remember, that is Minister Adams deal so you would need to talk to him.

    Kent)       I tried getting an answer from him, but haven’t had an answerfrom his office.

    Ellio)        That’s something that I don’t really know about because it is Minister Adams thing.

    Kent)       This is exactly the point of OMOV/SMC, you wouldn’t be able to pass it off.

    Ellio)        That wouldn’t change with SMC, because I am not in charge of that ministry.

    Kent)       But if you are my minister, you would have to find out what is up.

    Ellio)        Why?

    Kent)       Why!?  Because you represent me, and I called you to ask what is going on with it.  Beyond that you said on the radio you would find out and report back to me through the radio show the following week.

    Ellio)        I said that?

    Kent)       Yep, I can have the radio records pulled.  It was well over 4 weeks ago.  You gave me your word that you would find out.  And low and behold nothing.  This is a perfect example of why SMC is better.

    Ellio)        (while turning his back to Kent in mid sentence towards the other person in the same area) Man I can’t deal with this joker, let me talk to someone with sense.

    THE END

    The above is factual to the best of my recollection, and is a prime example of why MMC are a bad idea in a practical sense.  Both of the MLA mentioned above are my representitives on a national and district basis.  I still don't have an answer!

    • Anonymous says:

      Thanks for that Kent. I only wish this could be aired on TV, radio and in the newspaper for all to see.

      it shows the problem of our current systems very clearly.

       

    • Stiffed-Necked Fool says:

      Typical of the FOP, exactly like his mentor, The Dictator! Vote YES on July 18th!

    • Anonymous says:

      elio is an embaressment to politicians everywhere….

      • Anonymous says:

        Except in Cayman. Mac is rather proud of him and has stated that on several occasions.

        – OMOV is desperately needed. Vote YES.

  16. What !!!! says:

    July 18th and next year election i am voting for money/goods/HELP as I am in need of all 3. So come on down to crew road find me pay me half I vote take a picture show you and get paid the balance.I am serious this time .

  17. Anonymous says:

    Having OMOV is a good idea. However, single member constituencies is not. Cayman is simply too small to be divided into tiny districts.

    • Anonymous says:

      Here is my perspective on OMOV and SMC. Since I am a registered voter in West Bay I will still have 4 representatives. By having single member constituences I would have one of them represent my area directly but he/she would be still be a representative for West Bay and for the rest of the Cayman Islands.  The same how the Premier and the Leader of Opposition can influence who vote for their Party in other districts I can influence the voters  in other constituences not to support their MLA in their constitutency if they are not doing what they are being paid to do.

      I will be voting "YES" for one man, one vote,

      • Anonymous says:

        Thank you for that very clear explanation. I will be voting YES on Wednesday.

  18. Libertarian says:

    After listening to both opposition and the current government, I have considered the following facts:  The one person one vote – single-member constituency, divides the island into 18 electoral districts where a voter would be eligible to one vote for one representative or MLA for their district, it will reduce the population of a district by around 800 to 1000 persons, and hence the MLA will be able to interact more effectively with his district because of the reduce population he/she has to work with. Also, the people of the district will respond to one MLA and this would make the MLA more accountable to them. Minorities will be more represented and everyone would have an equal number of vote – that being one. The more electoral districts with fewer persons therein, is the more minorities will also have a fair chance to be heard. So fairness, accoutability, and representation, are three components of the one person one vote – single-member constituency system. However, the current government's stance to oppose it should also be looked into carefully. If one person only has one vote for one MLA candidate he sees in his district to represent his district and is unable to vote anymore after he has cast that vote, then that means that the voter will be unable to vote for the other 17 MLA candidates in the other districts, and in a sense that disenfranchises the voter in that the voter will not have that say as to who from the 17 can form his government. Moreover, voters will have less say as to who will be the MLA that gets Premiership. Whereas, those on the one person one vote side, believe that the minority-voters will become disenfranchise by not dividing the island into 18 districts, the current government has members that are saying that the voter who has more than one vote, but several will become disenfranchise because they will be limited and entrapped in a district where they may dislike a candidate in another district who may be a bad apple and end up becoming Premier. The voter will have his/her hands tied to see who other than one can make up his/her government. Considering the following factual and rational points that were made on both sides, I believe that best option for us is to call for a special commission of inquiry into the best electoral system that would be conducive to these islands in terms of democracy and democratic representation. The commission could carry out a particular task and duty of seeing the so many electoral systems out there, not just the one person one vote – single-member constituency system and not just the national vote system which gives far to much power to the majority. The special commission could recommend the best electoral system for Cayman and the next sitting government could unite with opposition and ensure it is enacted into law. There is so much disadvantages and advantages from both sides, and I feel that the short time we have to rush a decision to vote for this opov system on the 18th of July, may just may give us a premature result. If the opov do not pass, will government then launch a special commission?  If it does pass, will they still launch a special commission? … so that they can repeal it and we could have a realistic system in place for all of us.

    • Dred says:

      Libertarian.

      You need to stop drinking the UDP coolaide.

      This is brutally simple and to make it overcomplexed is simply to play into the hands of the UDP who are scared of the side affects of the OMOV SMC scenario.

      They are scared that:

      1) They will now be held accountable for their action or INaction as the case may be so often.

      2) That people, independents might come out of the woodwork that are strong in areas they are not particularly strong in because the new candidate thinks well in the past I woudl have had to have thousands of dollars to fight the PPM or UDP machinery but with a smaller populace to deal with they can stand a decent chance. What we are talking about is good hard working honest people who simply do not have the money to throw at a campaign because they are not funded by the Dart's of Cayman but they would be good for our country.

      3) Of possible head to head fights where their candidates can be taken out because possibly a PPM candidate could be stronger in that area.

      4) Of the BT situation where they disenfranchised many BT voters when they wanted to throw Dart's dump up there and now all Midland acres would rather see them lying face down under a mack truck.

      This has nothing to do with many of what you say. UDP and to an extent PPM are both scared. UDP by their direct actions and PPM by their inaction. Have you not noticed how silent PPM is on this? They coudl wage a good war for OMOV also alongside the OMOV team but they only quietly support it.

      So no commission or special group is needed or even desired simply because this group would be ladden down with UDP or PPM people and you can guess what their comeback would be.

      OMOV people do not say this but I do. The OMOV SMC system not only provides for equality in voters but it also levels the playing field a bit for candidates also. It's still not 100% level because party politics, voter engineering and all that still plays a big part but with a smaller community to appease to a candidate has a fighting chance now.

      The National Vote idea being thrown out is a really hard line party system where independent voters may as well not even run. Actually people from teh smaller districts may as well not even run because the 18 representives will all come from George Town, West Bay and Bodden Town. There will be no East End, North Side or Sister Islands people winning a seat. There is 13,000 votes in those districts vs 1,800 I believe in the other smaller districts. So in that scenario you will have someone for George Town looking out for the interest of the people of East End. How good do you think that representation will be?

      The National Vote is a waste of time that leads to disenfranchising many voters and creating even less accountability, decresaing or eliminating Independents and crushing our countries democracy. YES it is equality of voter but at the price of equality of representation.

      On July 18th 2012 VOTE YES for OMOV. It is the best system of voting for the people of the Cayman Islands. VOTE YES on OMOV.

      • Live Free.... says:

        Dred I agree with most of your post, except when you siad PPM is scared of one man, one vote. So tell me Dred, why would PPM wanted it put in the 2009 Constitution if they was afraid? And tell me why would Alden apologize on the behalf of PPM for relaxing it, because Mcdinejad wouldn't sign for the Constitution if it was not removed? This don't same like they are afraid of one man, one vote to me, it same more like Mcdinejad was more afraid to me then, and more afraid than ever now. So to me, your argument of PPM being afraid really make no sense, but I still give you thumbs up, and I encourageall Caymanians to Vote YES on Wednesday for One Man, One Vote, or One Person, One Vote. And show this Government you're not afraid to stand up for, Democracy, Equality and accountability. And to excercise your Democratic Rights, by not satying home.

        • Dred says:

          Live Free….Let me say this and we can be clear…

          I am neither UDP or PPM. In 2013 I will vote straight PPM because I do not want UDP in power EVER AGAIN. It's not because I like PPM but because I realise that UDP is far worse an option.

          In 2009 I made what I believe to be the worst mistake EVER and that was to vote split between UDP, PPM and Independent because truly this is what I wanted to see but NEVER EVER (as my old boss once said to me) as their is blood running thru my veins will I cast a vote to someone who is UDP or that has ANY be it 1 year or 10 years ago ties with UDP.

          I am so Anti-UDP now for all theyhave done to my country and how they have systematically sold our future out to anyone and everyone who would buy it. From Dart to CHEC to any and everyone who helps certain people line their pockets.

          Okay saying that I am also very objective and I truly call it as I see it.

          When I look at OMOV I see Ezzard and I see Arden fighting for it BUT I do not see PPM fighting for it. What I see them doing is hedging their bets. They are scared LIKE UDP that maybe they could loose in places they may win in normally due to SMC.

          I also say this because I know PPM has a money tree also much teh way UDP does BUT I see only signage and ads posted by the OMOV committee and their money pot. I see no PPM ads or signage to help get this pass the 7,500 votes we need.

          Don't believe me? Look at election time and watch the money and how it flows during that time.

          PPM is not against OMOV but they too are scared of how it will play out.

          I know of all the constitution stuff you do not have to lecture me on this but trust me when I tell you there is more to what went on that meets the eye. What I woudl like you to do is to not be as gullable as either party would like you to be. Take everything you hear from the parties with a grain of salt.

          It's not that they are some evil empire like UDP but they are scared of what can happen. The possibility of an independent getting in from an area they are not as strong in much the way UDP feels about West Bay.

          On July 18th VOTE YES TO OMOV!!!! Let's make the DREAM a REALITY!!!!

        • Dred says:

          I believe even Alden said he is a bit nervious about it.

          I am not saying they are not supporting it but very timidly.

          My grand mother always use to say it's in your actions that you speak the loudest.

    • Bueller says:

      Reducing the population of each district to 800 to1000 people is wrong. It will reduce the VOTING population to that amount, but the MLAs in the heavily populated districts will still serve many thousands of people, so there will not be any real benefit on that front.

      • Anonymous says:

        You are in correct. The geographical boundaries in the heavily populated areas will just b smaller.

      • Anonymous says:

        Let me guess, math was not your strongest subject at school.

    • Anonymous says:

      Libertarian, if you read the conversation above between Kent and Elio you will clearly see why the current system does not work for the people and allows the MLA's to be totally unaccountable to those who voted for them. It is just this simple.

       

    • Anonymous says:

      Lib, you are truly confused or you are trying to confuse– not sure which. The only question on ballot on Wednesday is whether we should have OMOV and single member constituencies. That’s it. And it is clear that voter equality is a great move forward for these islands. No one is saying this is the perfect system for rest of time. But I believe no one can argue against ALL Caymanians being equal. It is a common principle around the world in democracies and it should be here too.

      Talking about another “commission” is merely kicking the can further down the inequality road. It’s a stall tactic by government. Please vote YES. You cannot answer why All Caymanian should not be equal when they go to vote. Why one neighbour can have 4 votes and their cousin across the street only 3 or worst yet only one. That’s the question Wednesday. That’s all. Aiding government to kick can down the road and leaving it for some other folks to talk about in some civic centre is not right. Vote yes. Vote to make all Caymanians the same. That’s it Lib, nice and simple and logical!!!

  19. Anonymous says:

    Whilst I believe that OMOV is more equal I do NOT believe in having constintuencies.  It will cause division and i can't see how accountibility is a factor because we can change the Government at the polls at the next election.  Why can't we just go and vote for one person and the top 4 or 3 get in.  Sorry can't vote "Yes" as it is now. 

     

    • Dennie Warren Jr. says:

      Single-member constituencies do not divide residents; it is the individual beliefs of residents that divide us.

    • Kent McTaggart says:

      Please see my post above for a strong practical reason why single member const. are a good thing.  theory is just  that, practical is solid proof.  feel free to contact me also if I can help, as a no vote out of ignorance would be a shame.

       

      Kind Regards

      Kent

    • Anonymous says:

      Are you saying the the district “divisions” should go too. We are divided by districts now.

      This “don’t vote to divide us” is pure nonsense. As another blogger said–Do you think the folks in Savannah think they live in Bodden Town?. Or the folks in South Sound really think the live in George town or the folks on Queen’s highway really think they live in East End?? Or the folks in Britannia really think they live in West Bay?? Don’t think so….

      These are all artificial VOTING DIVISIONS –yep that’s what they are called. This argument of dividing us is a mere distraction and the PR line of government. Please don’t fall for it. In fact it’s hilarious – “don’t divide us, go and voteto keep us divided as to how many votes you have based on where you live””. Vote YES for logic, vote YES for equality.

    • Anonymous says:

      I bet most people don't even know where the current dividing line is between polling divisions. There is no way OMOV can be divisive because we vote for one person and most people find it hard to find 4 good candidates to vote for. This is how people like Eugene get in in West Bay, do nothing for 12 years and still collect a salary.

      I will vote YES on Wednesday. 

  20. Jarrett Nicholson says:

    Vote yes on Wednesday! We have to show government officals that they work for the Caymanianpeople and not for the benefit of rich investors.They have raised the cost of doing business for the hard working people while cutting costs for people who can afford OUR duties……think dart really needs a break on duties. Vote yes on Wednesday if for no other reason to show that we the Caymanian people want accountability and transparency in government. OMOV is where we start taking OUR island back before it's gone forever. 

    • Anonymous says:

      We keep forgetting this is not about Dart and the present government. These will come and go ..We are talking about our future.

      This whole OMOV has become a lightening rod to get rid of the present government, then what? We have to think longer than our nose. As far as i am concerned the UDP governemnt will be gone next election and then we will be saddled with these load of little districts cannibalizing each other and causing further division.

      I am for one OMOV but not for single member constituencies. I am voting NO. This refrendum as it is will destroy these beautiful islands more than any government UDP or PPM could ever do. Mark my words!!

      • Anonymous says:

        You're wrong. This is a far deeper issue than single member constituencies (SMC). This is about a renegate dictatorial government which just happens to be UDP (that part is irrelevant) which has taken up the role of telling people how to vote on the peoples referendum which government took for themselves. This alone is reson to vote "YES" in order to show them our distaste for what they have done and continue to do. It doesn't matter which party is in power, such interference by a government in a referendum for voting changes is just plain wrong, indecent, immoral, unethical and maybe illegal. Voting "no" plays into their hands and enables them to run rough shod over the citizens of Cayman. Deal with this corrupt government now and worry about changing the voting methos later. Vote "YES".

         

        Voting "YES" will not be the catastrophe that you claim. It has be done in countless countries small and large with nothing but good results. Please show me one case where single member constituencies have led to the ruination of a country. The only thing it ruins is the politicians' ability to evade their responsibilities.

         

      • Anonymous says:

        We have already been divided by green and red.

    • Anonymous says:

      Good Job Jarrett. People don't realize the harm duty concessions have to the rest of us. Government still needs the money and the rest of us are left to pay. A better way to handle this problem would be to drastically reduce duties accross the board to much lower levels making goods more affordable and lower the cost of living. Then making the rich developers pay their fair share which would be less than if duties were at their current rate. It's a win-win and would indeed spur economic growth and employment here.

  21. Anonymous says:

    IF YOU'RE STILL UNDECIDED CONSIDER THIS:

     

    No government has the right to tell the people how to vote on any issue. Especially using public money to do so. This is what happens in countries ruled by dictators. Elio, Rolston, McKeeva and other sitting members have tried to justify this immoral and possibly illegal act. The UDP has the right to spend its own money to influence voting as does the PPM or any other party. In the USA, it is common at election time for the Republican National Committee or the Democratic National Committee to spend their own monies to advertise how they think people should vote. But the government never takes sides because the government is supposed to be for all of the people not just for the party in power.

     

    The bottom line is this: Based on what this government has done, you should run, not walk to the nearest polling place and vote a resounding "YES" simply to show those in government that they have crossed a very fragile line by taking sides in this matter. Remember, this was originally a peoples referendum which was hijacked by government in order to try to fight it. The biggest mistake any Caymanian voter will make on Wednesday is by following the dictates of government or by not voting at all. This is not about UDP or PPM, it is about stopping a potential dictatorship in its tracks before it's too late. Only a "YES" vote can accomplish this.

     

    If this doesn't wake you up to reality then there really is no hope for Cayman.

     

    • Anonymous says:

      Unfortunately there are people on the electoral register who are no longer able to vote as it obviously has not been updated vigilantly.  My father's name is still listed and he passed away over two years ago after not living in Cayman for over 10 years! I have emailed the office and received no reply but it begs the question as to how many other names have not been removed and are counting towards the total number of votes required.

    • Dred says:

      Let me expand or explain how the government moving in any direction is wrong.

      A Government seat is neither for or against any position. It is in all intense purposes neutral. I has no voice or opinion as it does only what it is asked to do in terms of functions.

      When the UDP government decided that the government should take a position for or against it in effect was abusing it position in office because it reflected the seat holders person opinion on the process. This is no different than a political figure ensuring his company got a contract in a deal that was overseen by the official who owns the business. He is afterall using his seat or position to influence the outcome of a decision that has a direct impact on his teams ability to retain power by using government money.

      I woudl have had no issue if UDP used their funds but they did not.

      The rebuttal would be that they feared the results from the country and it is out of fear for their country that the GOVERNEMT took a position BUT this is wrong. As I said a seat can only be neutral. A chair has no voice or opinion for that matter.

      This should be investigated by teh AG asproper use of government funds.

  22. pirate $bill says:

    Yo Ho Yo Ho Its a pirate life for me we rob we steal we pillage we fight we embezzle we sho our might we bribe all right so eat and drink up mi hearties we love our Captain Korrup yo ho yo ho it's a pirates life for me

    • Chris Johnson says:

      Today we celebrate the birth of Woody Guthrie, one hundred years ago, a folksinger who throughout his life fought for social injustice. John Mellancamp paid him a tribute with the following words and they are relevant to today’s issues in the Cayman Islands.

      Most folks are to take the path of least resistance
      To sit on the sidelines and watch the world go by
      And yell obscenities from the dark
      Not this bird
      He has no desire to take the easy way out
      He sees the world through a long lens
      And through that lens he knows
      How out of kilter the place really is

      Perhaps the Cayman Islands will be blessed with a Woody Guthrie in the not too far distant future.

      • SKEPTICAL says:

        This is a bit bloody profound Mr Johnson, on a Sunday morning eating breakfast – but very true.

        • Morse says:

          Skeptical at 11.50 are you not late eating your breakfast? Anyway I support Chris and was it not Woody that sang This Land is my land? And no commissions paid either.

      • Asterisk McFootnote says:

        Chris, why don’t you run?

  23. Anonymous says:

    This has now become what we have been trying to say we don't want.

    It is now a competition between two parties and decisions will be made along party lines..

    Do we really need more division than we already have?

     

    • Dred says:

      In the case of UDP and the rest of us YES. We would like you all to pack up and leave these Islands because the UDP is out to ruin this country.

  24. Anonymous says:

    Don't miss the bigger point. The debate is all about OMOV. However, a much more important issue underlies this debate. Once again our elected government is telling us what to do. They are using our money to tell us to vote “NO” in our first ever referendum. It is incumbent upon all registered voters to but aside your views on OMOV and show this government that our new Constitution is for the people and not for government to manipulate the people to suit its own needs. We must stand together and vote yes simply because this government doesn't want you to. The message we can send by voting “YES” is far more important than the issue on the ballot.

     

    Please stop and think about Egypt, Libya, and Syria. Those people did not have the ability to change the course of their governments. We now do and we need to stand up and take the control which government is trying so hard to keep from us

    • Anonymous says:

      hey, leave Egypt out of this. They have just democratically elected a new president and the old dictator is, um, in a coma I think, but never-the-less. you're worng about Egypt.

      • Anonymous says:

        You are forgetting the blood in streets that spilled in order for such democrativ elections to take place.

  25. Anonymous says:

    Charles "The Killer" Whittaker has it backwards. He is the star of a TV ad paid for by the Premier urging people to vote "NO" on Wednesday. He claims that he wants as many people in his corner as possible to help him win his fights. This is exactly backwards. The people in his corner as well as the rest of his countrymen are his support. He is fighting for them as well as for himself. He represents Cayman just as a single member would represent his voting district under OMOV.

     

    To compare apples to apples, If a boxing match were held to the current voting method in Cayman using multiple representatives for each district, then there would be multiple boxers in the ring representing each side and total confusion would result. None of the boxers would know which opponent to hit and it would resemble a disorganized street fighting brawl in which there is no plan of attack and no efficiency or accountability. None of the fighters would know who is supposed to hit who. And of course if their team lost, each boxer would blame the other rather than take the blame himself. 

     

    Coincidentally, this sounds a lot like the way our country is currently being run.

     

    We must thwart this governments’ effort to keep us down by voting "Y E S" on Wednesday.

    Even if you believe voting NO is the right thing to do, you should vote YES anyway to send a clear message to government that the people have the power and will not be told what to do. This lesson for them is far greater than a change in how we vote. This is our first referendum. Let's show the world that we are in control of our representatives.

    VOTE YES, FOR YOURSELF AND THE FUTURE OF CAYMAN.

     

     

     

    • Anonymous says:

      Trust me when I say this; While I have respect for Charles "The Killer" Whittaker as a boxer and a person trying to reach somewhere in the sport.

      Im not going to be taking anything other than boxing lessons from him. His talent is in his hands… no where else, if you get the drift..

    • Anonymous says:

      It's much simpler than that. McKeeva gave "Killa" $100,000 from the Nation Building Fund, so Killa will say whatever McKeeva wants him to say.

    • Anonymous says:

      Charles the Killer can say a lot of things. Gov't paying him to be a social role model. He does not have a job, he is not married and he no worries, he does his aerobic exercising when we going a work. Boy we should really listen to him, he done things right!

    • Anonymous says:

      Don’t forget Charles is on salary from us. The Caymanian people pay him each year. He has to say what McKeeva says or he will starve. Ignore him now and at his next fight cheer for the other guy. That’s what he effectively is doing to us now!!!

    • Anonymous says:

      money talks….. a real pro!

  26. Knot S Smart says:

    Actually OMOV is a good first step!

    If we get through this one then we need another referendum held at the same time as the next election which should address the issue of a national vote for the selection of who will be the Ministers of Govt and who will be the Premier.

    That will bring real democracy, more political stability, and should help solve the problem that is created when powerful special interest groups donate funds to a particular party campaign and then in turn receive special benefits after the election etc. etc. etc…

     

  27. Dicktator Must Go says:

    I am not stuck with any indecisions except this; "I will support any form of voting that gets out of the clutches of the country's first dicktator.  Please take note, I am an excellent speller, but the current spelling is exactly how I feel about what we are being forced to live with.  You would think that the general Caymanian population all have the "cattle complex".  We must follow the leader, regardless of what he leads us in.  We all need to step back this weekend and decide if we want to continue living under the thumb of any one man, or if we want true representation in our government.  McKeeva has taken enough bread from our children now, it is time for him to voluntarily step down "for the good of God and Country". I noticed where Anglin spouted off on a system, that if everyone believed, would certainly remove him and his cronies from power. 

     

  28. Anonymous says:

    Free fridge, stoves, sand in westbay & free paving only in cayman Brac this weekend lol!

  29. Dreadlock Holmes says:

    If these gentlemen of the UDP are so concerned about Cayman – why haven't they stood up to Premier Bush as he has flailed himself through countless irregularities, disenfranchised the UK, and the voting public in genereal, and dreadfully mis-managed the economy?  Who are they accountable to?  Quick answer: the voters. Wrong answer: the UDP.  But they don't understand that and would rather "research" the issue some more.  It's too late for that. OMOV is coming to get you.

  30. Libertarian says:

    Wow… reviewing over and over again my stance, we learn as we go. OPOV (one person one vote) is for fairness, accountability, and yes it is for better representation for minorities. However, my gravest concern about the OPOV system, is when it is implemented and I don’t want to see a candidate become an MLA in another district from mine, what choice do I have to prevent this from happening and suppose that MLA becomes the Premier, under the OPOV, what direct choice do I have to prevent this from happening? Under the OPOV system, my hands will be tied to only dealing my elected MLA for my district, but I find it worrisome that I would be unable to participate with the other districts in shaping my government. Hence, I am not satisfied with the OPOV if you can only cast 1 vote. At least you should have the option of casting 2 votes. One for your MLA and another for who you think should be Premier. Like I said one month ago. I would have preferred if it was one man two votes for everyone. That way the people will be able to directly recall or vote out the Premier if he is a bad apple, because they were directly involved in voting for him. Yes I believe in representing the minorities by having single-member constituencies, but with OPOV concept where you only have one vote and that vote should be for your district MLA, I now feel it sort of limits the voter from more direct participation in shaping his / her government. Of course not, I don’t believe a National Vote is the answer, because I know for sure it would disenfranchise the Sister Islands, as the majority would rule in such a system. So learning more about this subject, I find that learning itself is an evolutionary process. Sorry, until someone here can convince me otherwise, I will have to PAUSE from making a decision as to how I am going to vote. I have put myself again in a valley of decision to look at the pros and cons, learn more, and investigate more closely. I recommend everyone do the same and don’t make the mistake of pridefully hardening your judgement on the subject unless you know for certain that a decision is the right one. Seeing that it is next Wednesday, that is a short time. I see why I can agree with others, when they think, why the rush? The study of electoral systems is a very vast subject. There is more than one electoral system, so don’t expect me or anyone in a split second to know the best system for everybody. You have to know for yourself. Libertarian

    • Anonymous says:

      Lib, I have to commend you on such an educated sensible comment. I was worried about the direction you were headed in, on the stupid strategy,  the opposition and political hopefulls are using to remove the UDP.

       I guess by now the pictutre is on the wall, it's not about accountability and equality, it's about them wanting the power, isnt that the way it is with politicians… world over?

      There are two people I always look forward for  educated comments, yourself and Whodatis, keep up the good works!

      You should run for office one day!

  31. Len Layman says:

    As we get closer to the referendum, if we are expected to be taken seriously, I ask that you please step up speak your mind, and when you post do not do so anonymously.

    We are fighting for the right to have a say in the way our country is run so we do not have to live in fear of retribution for what we think and say.  This starts by taking responsibility for what we believe and say. I feel strongly about this.  Let us show those who would quiet us that they can't.   If we do not "They" win!

    Remember apathy and fear are the only things that can defeat us.  Stand up! Stand proud!  Speak out and take responsibility. 

    I hope our friends that disagree with us feel they can do the same thing.

    Bring a friend and vote Yes on 18 July.  Be the one to put it over the top.

    Please!

  32. Anonymous says:

    Clearly they are running scared. And Elio and his diversionary foolishness – give me a break, pal. Do you imagine us to be as gullible as you? You've taken a gamble on the gambler. Question is, will it pay off?

    • Anonymous says:

      There is problem i have with the one man one vote – politicians now have to look after the wishs of a smaller group of people. It means less fridges, loads of top soil and other goodies to buy the votes.

      • Anonymous says:

        It means you go to jail easier for corruption– smaller area. Easier to come to light!!

  33. anonymous says:

    In August 1948 twenty four brave women petitioned for the right to vote. It took until the 1959 constitution for women to be seen as equal and have a chance to vote. No one today would question this right but back then there were many arguments about why they should not change the existing system- "after all it worked for all these years as it is". Sounds familiar? It took women 11 long years to get that right.

    On Wednesday we have a chance to again go into the history books with another step closer to true democracy by voting YES to make all Caymanians equal–to change a system where some are 6 times more important than others just because of where they live.

    Vote YES…be one of 7,583 history making Caymanians whose children and grandchildren will look back at as being brave to stand up to make these Cayman Islands a better and fairer place. Make 2012 the year when equality finally came to our voting system.

    • Anonymous says:

      Not bad for a little Island like ours. In the  USA it took women decades to get to final victory. indroduced in congress in 1878 and final results came in 1920.

      Whats this got to do with OMOV, whats the comparison?

      • Anonymous says:

        I took the post to be an encouragement to people to take a stand for what they believe in – even in the face of opposition.  If it is important – and the vote on OMOV is – then those who are for it must stand together to see that it comes to pass.

         

      • Anonymous says:

        To "Not bad for a little island", this has everything to do with OMOV. In a word, equality. 

  34. anonymous says:

    Foolio did pretty well last night,he had the audience clapping pretty hard and shook up Ezzard a bit.

    • Anonymous says:

      Foolio will never amount to anything more than a mouth champion. It's always the empty tin can that makes the most noise.

    • Anonymous says:

      But not as much as Alden shook up Foolio a few months ago.

    • Anonymous says:

      By "the audience" you mean his wife and a couple of other people?

    • Anonymous also says:

      Notice they applauded when he stopped talking!

    • Anonymous says:

      Not so. UDP brought along a small but loud cheering section (no more than about 6) who clapped for anything either Rolston or Ellio said. The vast majority of the audience did not cheer them at all. I did not see that Ezzard was shaken up at all.  

    • Anonymous says:

      Correction to Foolio did really well:

      Ellios wife and two other people clapped really hard every time he or Rolston spoke.

  35. Anonymous says:

    Let me try to help the undecided voter or voters…………..We now have a government that is no longer a democracy but has become a complete and blatant dictatorship under the absolute and single rule of the Premier.  Additionally the dictator himself is being investigated for at  least 3 criminal offences and he is still being upheld and supported by his party fries when if they had any morals, values, balls or the peoples interst at heart tey would have asked him to step down at least until the investigations were complete.  The UDP hijacked the People Initiated Referendum plans and have put stipulations on the referendum vote to make it nearly impossible to pass.  Then they started using public monies to campaign against their own referendum!  Are you still not clear why we should have a change in the way we vote here???????  One Man One Vote is the only way for us to even think about digging out of the mess we are in.  When we canelect persons who we can actually hold accountable and not have them blame someone else in their party or group for their incompetence and ineffectiveness and inefficienceis we will begin to make progress and end the blatant corruption and extinguish the bang and blame mentality and regimes that have existed for the past many years.  Just do yourself and the rest of us all a HUGE favor….do the RIGHT thing……VOTE         "Y E S"     on Wed. July 18th, 2012 .       .  

  36. Whodatis says:

    Question(s):

    • (a.) Under the proposed OMOV set-up, will a candidate be required to be physically resident within his or her respective single member constituency?
    • (b.) Will I be limited to votingfor a single candidate from within the constituency that I reside?

    * If the answer is yes to both, does this not carry an increased risk of the odd dumb-ass being elected to the legislative assembly?

    For example, do we have any idea of the current dispersal of suitable individuals across the districts?

    Will such factors be taken into account when the districts are officially drawn up? (Not that I would support such a notion.)

    On the other hand, what about the instance where 'educated' or 'suitable' individuals are concentrated within a particular sub-community / sub-development within a certain district?

    Would this not carry the potential of a vast number of well-meaning and beneficial individuals being excluded from political office under OMOV?

    All of the above are genuine questions and concerns and I look forward to some feedback in this regard. Many thanks in advance.

     – Whodatis

    • Bueller says:

      Excellent points Whodatis. I’m also concerned that I might end up having to pick one of a bad bunch… Small districts lead to the likes of Hazzard and ‘Ardon getting elected with a few hundred votes. That is not a good thing in my opinion.

      • Anonymous says:

        Ezzard and Arden are the two hardest working MLAs. They are an excellent advertisement for OMOV SMCs.  

    • Problem Solved says:

      In this so called democracy, anyone who meets the minimum qualifications can run for office.

      It is up to you the voter to chose the person you believe will best represent your interest in the House. If you are not happy with the performance of your elected member then vote them out next time.

      Problem Solved

    • Anonymous says:

      Dear Whodatis,

       

      1. Yes, your elected candidate must be a member of and reside in your district.

      2. If your district is full of nothing but "dumb-asses" then you must obviously be the only

       "non-dumb-ass" since you are able to recognize all of the rest of your district as being "dumb-asses. Therefore, to ensure that you don't get a "dumb-ass" to represent you, perhaps you should run for office to guarantee that.

      • Dred says:

        #1 is no. Not yes. Take Jurt Tibbetts who resides in BT but votes in GT. It is not a requirement at all.

    • Anonnymous says:

      I believe you are right, Whodatis.  Any dumb-ass can get elected.  And no, a candidate is not required to physically reside in the constituency in which he choses to run.  We have that now of course, with George Town and East End – both districts have representatives who do not live in those districts.

    • Anonymous says:

      In order to assist:

      Taking your questions in turn-

      (a) No: during the 2009 Constituitonal refers this was not changed- so candidates are allowed as before to run in any constituency of their choosing. Example, Kurt Tibbetts lives in Bodden Town but continued to run successfully in George Town. Bo Miller lives North Side but ran in GT. Choppy Delapena lives Gzt but ran WB. There are other examples, Walling Whittaker, Eddie Thompson as well – hope this assists.

      (b) yes: however there is no limit to how many persons may run in a constituency or in any election. not to worry- the parties will ensure candidates are sufficiently spread to all constituency – regardless of where they actually reside: see (a) above.

      So, vote YES on July 18

      Fora better Cayman

    • Anonymous says:

      Good questions.

      The current system has not prevented several odd dumb-asses from being elected, so perhaps the two systems would not differ greatly.  However, I suspect that there is a sufficient supply of intelligent and truly honourable persons within each district to provide the representation, leadership and action that is desired and necessary from an MLA.

      Also, if there are several "well-meaning and beneficial individuals" within a district who wish to work in government or influence the way government behaves, then selecting the single person you think is best in no way prevents the others from taking part in the processes of government.  There are PLENTY of opportunities to contribute in a positive and productive manner and having well-meaning and beneficial individuals working in a variety of areas, in a variety of ways would (I suspect) actually improve the overall performance of government.  It is actually that sort of broad infusion of talent, ideas and willingness to serve that I believe would best benefit government and the people of the Cayman Islands.

    • Anonymous says:

      The answer is yes to both.
      The system is Just like what happens in east end and north side now. This fact however does not really change the potential of an unsuitable candidate arriving in the legislative assembly. We have seen in the current system people elected that say nothing, appear to have great difficulty even completing a full sentence and clearly could not run a ministry nor represent the Cayman islands at the UN or similar international arena. Yes that could happen in a single man constituency as it does now. Captain Eugene comes to mind. Is he a great person, gets arounds and helps people, etc–yes, love the man however would not make him finance minister nor send him to Paris to discuss FATF. The question is therefore who makes a “good” representative? It’s we the people that decide and we should thinkcarefully that the 15 that we send there should be more than “good buddies” and “nice guys or girls”.

      The biggest issue with single person constituencies is the boundary control and how the country is divided up. You could have a situation where the boundaries are created specifically to suit a certain demographic. So it winds down this street then up the other etc to attempt to “load” a certain area with a certain type of person. This is the work of the boundary commission who has completed this work already. You may not notice but for the last two elections we have been voting in special locations based on where we live–we are already voting in single person areas it is just that we still get to add 3 or 4 votes instead of one. The boundary commission has done actually a great job in dividing the areas to get even member numbers but most importantly not creating enclaves of like voters. For instance south sound is divided into two- the eastern half of south sound votes with red bay, tropical gardens, etc and the western half votes with walkers road, the school area and yes, windsor park. Clearly this was not done randomly. It will work to avoid enclaves.
      But even under the current system you could have boundary manipulation. Two years ago the Premier publicly stated that west bay district boundary should really move to the wharf restaurant and west bay would then add one more seat. We the people have to be aware of this and ensure we go to the boundary commission’s meetings etc. In most countries these disputes have a process of resolution as does it here.

      The last part of your question is that nothing will change in the current system of where one can run and where one can vote. Currently, and also with OMOV, anyone can run anywhere but you can only vote where you live. Many representatives currently cannot vote for themselves. Arden, Kurt, Alfonzo, etc all live in Bodden Town. Going to OMOV it however may reduce this. It is one thing to represent George town and live in Bodden town but it will be a different thing to represent GT north and live in Bodden town- it is likely you will need better and closer contact with you constituency.

      So i hope that helps…..

      • Dred says:

        Actually the answer to #1 is NO. OMOV does not change the current laws in this regard. Just like Kurt can run for GT but live in BT.

        This is not addressed with OMOV.

    • Dred says:

      Well Question 1 is no for sure. OMOV does not change anything like this. This actually requires a change to the constitution and/or the elections law.

      The answer to question 2 is yes. Hence the term One Man One Vote.

      In West Bay there will be four constituencies and all 4 UDP will be spread across those 4 areas. It is not to say that any of them reside in the one they are running in. Let's look at Kurt as an example. Kurt lives in the BT area but has run in GT for what seems to be forever because he has business interest there.

      OMOV does not change any of those sections of the law. IT only allows for the 18 constituences and sets out the simple fact that while we can have a plethora of candidates its the one with the most votes that gets in.

      Let's not confuse the situation because I believe you know full well these answers.

    • Anonymous says:

      Whodatis I am struggling to believe that these are genuine questions. You are an intelligent, well-read individual. I think you know better than these questions suggest.

      For other readers, there is no requirement that a candidate must reside within a single member constituency anymore than there is presently a requirement that a candidate must reside within the electoral district that he represents. We all know that MIke Adam lives in WB but represents GT as an MLA, Kurt Tibbetts lives in BT but represents GT as an MLA etc. Anyone qualified to be a candidate can run for any district he likes. Of course if he is sensible he will choose the one in which he has the most support.

      I am not sure I understand the second question. If it means will OMOV mean I can only vote for one candidate who is on the ballot paper in my constituency then obviously the answer is yes. That is the whole point of OMOV SMCs.         

    • An Onymous says:

      ANSWER(S):

      • (a.) Under the proposed OMOV set-up, a CANDIDATE is NOT required to be physically resident within his or her respective single member constituency BUT he or she may be resident in ANY constituency OR in fact ANY District in ANY of the three Cayman Islands.

      (NOTE:  a candidate can only VOTE in the constituency in which he or she RESIDES.

      • (b.) YES, you the VOTER will be limited to voting for a single candidate from within the constituency in which you reside?

      i hope these genuine answers will help you to decide which way to vote next Wednesday 18th JULY 2012 – hopefully you will vote YES!

       

       

    • Libertarian says:

      Also Whodatis consider, when the OPOV is implemented and I don't want to see a candidate become an MLA in another district from mine, what choice do I have to prevent this from happening?  And suppose that MLA candidate for the other district is a bad apple, and you know he is, but he becomes the Premier, then what???  Under the OPOV system, my hands would be tied to only vote for the candidate in my particular district. At least, when I had more than one vote, I had more choices in shaping the government I wanted to see. I said this a month ago and I say it again, Ezzard and OPOV team should have really pushed for ONE PERSON TWO VOTES, meaning each person would be able to vote for their particular district MLA and have another vote on hand to vote for who they would like to see Premier. At least that would remedy the delimma I just described to you. No… I think we need a special commission with the sole task of deciding the best electoral system that would be conducive to the people of these islands representation. If the OPOV pass on the 18th of July it won't be too late. A commission can still be launched and if needs be the OPOV system can be repealed for a better system, and perhaps maytake OP2V into conderation as well or a bicameral legislature. Remember the time we rush for ratifying a new Constitution with a transition from LOGB to a Premier… now everybody is banging their heads as to what just happened. Regards

      • Anonymous says:

        Lib, you have suddenly changed your tune into undermining the yes vote for the referendum. I hope you were not motivated by a 'gift' to do so.

        Obviously we do not now have the ability to vote to stop someone from being elected in another electoral district. As much as I would like to see Ellio out of office I do not vote in GT. So why is that a valid objection to OMOV SMCs? 

        • Libertarian says:

          I can assure you I am not sold. I know the one person one vote system is not perfect, but I am dissatisfied. I would like to see more to the opov system than what I am seeing. Will there be further democratic reforms to our electoral system other than what the Opposition is pushing for?  Will it make any difference from the system we have now when we still don't have any real say on who becomes Premier, and the power to remove Premiers that we find incompetent?  Regards 

          • Anonymous says:

            It is not perfect but it is a first step in the right direction. If we do not have at least a majority of those voting vote in favour of the referendum the government will say the whole issue of electoral reform is dead. By muddying the waters now you play into their hands.     

  37. Power to the People says:

    I don't normally get political but when something is so important I

    feel the need to inform. I hope you are voting on July 18th.

    You may already have decided what you will do but I would like to show you

    why voting "YES" is good for each and every citizen of Cayman. I will use an anectdote I heard on the radio earlier this week.

    Imagine a mother with 4 children who is leaving for work. As she leaves she turns and

    tells each child the following, "Jimmy, I want you to clean the kitchen

    before I come home tonight. Sarah, I want you to dust and vacuum all rooms,

    Keisha, I want you to make the beds and do the laundry, and Jason, I want you to

    fix the broken leg on the coffee table."  Now when she comes home from work

    and sees that one of the tasks is not done, she knows exactly who is to

    blame. Each child is responsible for his or her territory and is held totally

    responsible for not doing as was expected. 

     

    On the other hand, a mother who leaves the house and says to all the children, "I want this house clean and the laundry done before I come home" No doubt she will come home to a house that is not properly cleaned etc because no one wanted to do the laundry or clean the

    bathrooms.

     

    Having one member of the LA responsible for one group of people

    gives the power directly to the people he or she represents even if they are

    of the opposing party. He must perform and answer to ALL the people first and

    foremost and put party politics aside if he wants to get re-elected. In this

    way the people have gained the power of determining their own destiny

    rather than having a politician telling them what is best for them based on

    party guidelines and platforms.



    Please vote "YES" on OMOV and tell all your friends and family to do the

    same. The above story should help make it clear to them. If they say it will

    divide the country, simply show them that the current system has divided us

    more than ever before without giving us any power or making our elected

    officials accountable to us.



    "Power to the People" is what this governent is fighting against by telling you to vote "NO". It is time to stand up and show them where the true power lies.

    VOTE YES!!!!!!!!!

  38. Anonymous2 says:

    This weekend upon us, people, don't stay home, knock on doors, because I know McKeeva's crew will be out there doing the same. Dont become to complacent and think we will reach the magic number of 7600. This weekend make it a goal to reach at least 10 persons and inform them about the OMOV, and that voting is on Wednesday.

    • Anonymous says:

      Stop brain washing the people. UDP dont need to go knocking on any doors. The committee and whoever using this strategy to topple Makeeva are the ones hanging out at supermarkets and runnig from door todoor begging people to vote yes.

      You not only become complacent, you have become disoriented, mad  and stupid….you will never reach that number…you sound so desparate already. you lost the battle.

  39. Anonymous says:

    While i am in favor of one man one vote, it means nothing if we aren't engageg in the management of our country after we vote on election day.  Everything that has gone on so far with this gvernment and the last could have easily been solved if we the people cared enough in large enough numbers to get out and get under the skin of our representatives through the means of protesting or showing up at their offices of constantly calling them or any other lawful means of getting their attention. 

    I hope for a change next election not to the way it was but to the way it should be which is a cayman islands where i can maintan a job and raise my kids in a safe environment where they can look forward to having a prosperous future in their country.

  40. Libertarian says:

    @ comment 11:43 –

    But the country is already divided. And since when did having electoral districts equates with a country being divided?  Divided districts and the country being divided against itself are two different things. So are you saying the United States with its 50 states is garrison and divided??? There is something called "unity in diversity." Yes unity is a virtue… but a virtue for whom???  Satan's kingdom with his myriad of demons could be united as one, but to whose benefit?  Satan's of course. The one person one vote single-member constituency system, promotes more representation. Try having unity without representation… that will result in mob rule!

  41. Anonymous says:

    The UDP is against the OMOV and the PPM has in recent time offered lukewarm support. Neither political party wants it because the fear is that they will lose some power over influencing the outcome of elections. Therefore, the logical conclusion that must be drawn from this is that OMOV is GOOD because it actuals puts more power in the hands of the electorate.

  42. Anonymous says:

    You cannot get accountabilty by dividing the country, it starts from within the person that is running for office.  Take your position serious from the beginning an accountibility wont be an issue.  VOTE NO

    • anonymous says:

      When you can answer this question you can think of voting No:

      Is it fair for one Caymanian on one side of the street to be able to vote 4 or 6 times but his neighbor literally across the road, 50 feet away, to only be able to vote 3 or four times, or even worst only 1 time?? This hapens now.

      Clearly, It should not be the case that where you decide to live in these islands is the sole reason that decides how many votes you have. This is not fair and certainly not equality.

      Dividing country??  Its divided now based on the fact that some folks can vote 4 times and some only once.

      VOTE YES for logic and equality.

       

       

    • Anonymous says:

      I agree that is exactly why we need to get rid of the UDP, they are never accountable for anything.

      • Anonymous says:

        14;24

         

        Well stop telling the people lies. This whole strategy is to get rid of the UDP… as your own words, its not about giving the people accountablity.

        I hope you all reading this, can see the shit these people are trying to drag you all through….false hope…. setting you up to fail.

        Should anyof these get in power they already know they can blame someone else. For example, Ezzard and Arden are both single member constituency and OMOV. now tell me, who do they blame? where are there accountability to their constituency? none, none. Vote no! 

    • Anonymous says:

      You are clearly clueless as to how OMOV works in practice.  Its the ONLY way to gain accountability from our politicians, who will no longer be able to hide behind each other and point fingers elsewhere.

      • Anonymous says:

        15:37

         

        Sounds like you got the bug, that is the biggest pack of shit i have ever heard of. you really think that any polititions are going to be personally accountable to you or any other man or woman, you all are really stupid if you all believe this shit.

        Its not their job to be accountable to individules, they are law makers, and policy makers, and too busy trying to get this country back on a good financial foundation, and they will… and we will but them back in to run the country.

        • Anonymous says:

          You could not be more wrong.  Being accountable to their constituents (look it up if you have to) is EXACTLY the job of politicians.  They may not want to.  They may not be able to.  But that is their ultimate, most important responsibility and everything else follows.

           

        • Anonymous says:

          And if you think they are not pandering to specific individual developers wishes (Dart) rather than individuals (1300 WB protesters) you are sorely mistaken.

        • Anonymous says:

          My simple question to you is can you pay your electricity bill to run the refrigerator you got at the last elections?

          Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day, Teach a man to fish and you feed him for a life time….
          Our politicians all give you small handouts at elections knowing you will stay indebted to them election after election.

          Regarding who you vote for is your democratic right. I’m good with you voting anyway and for anyone. Its the government that has turned this issue political. They did not have too. However voting YES on Wednesday will be a way of teaching you and your children how to fish. You will take back more of the power from the politicians- from both of the so called parties. Not perfect but a whole lot better than some of us voting 6 times and some only once. I vote in George town but my poor cousins up in east end only got one vote. Just because I moved house. Silly system, undemocratic system….understand why this is not about UDP nor PPM..this is about democracy and you should vote YES. And if you think the current government is doing great, fine, vote for the representative in your area…simple.

        • The Parliamentarian says:

          What drivel!  I am surprised your attendants (or caretakers) let you out long enough to make such statements.  Who are you referring to with your statement, "they are law makers, and policy makers, and too busy trying to get this country back on a good financial foundation."?  It certainly isn't anyone I have heard of!

          • Anonymous says:

            Anon 08: 43

            You have a short memory. Remember..we both were let out by the same attendant and caretakers.

            Only differenc you can't see no further than your nose. You so hell bent on getting this government out and putting who you want for your own gain, that you fail to  see the hard work this government is doing.

            But no worries, you will  be seeing  all the results sooner than later, then what are you going to use for amonition? you will find something else to bitch about….wont you? its not about the works of this administration, it's because you sever your ties with them and now you get jack shit.

            • Anonymous says:

              It seems like you must be drinking a lot of McChavez' cool-aid.  No matter who is related to whom and no matter what someone gave you for nothing, please get someone to read the news for you.  If you still have any of your senses left, you will see that after 3 years and one month, the country is as lot worst off than we were.  The global recession which caused every nation serious problems was not the fault of the PPM Government, but the selling of the Cayman Islands to Kenneth Dart is the fault of one man and he is your premier.  XXXX He and his supporters are spouting nonsense, because they believe that the almighty dollar is going to get them into heaven.  It  won't and if you want to go, you had better stop following the herd of swine to the edge of the bluff.  The bluff gives out on July 18th, so you better put on your parachutes, before you fall.

        • Dred says:

          McKeeva cronies chatting crap again.

          WOW I would like all people of Cayman to read this line clearly and people this tells it all about the UDP. I will say it in a separate line because I think you should see this CLEARLY.

          Its not their job to be accountable to individules.

          This is the UDP mentality.

          Let me put this to you in a way I hope you can grasp. WE VOTED THEIR ASSES IN. WE DID. WE OWN THEIR ASS. They are COMPLETLY and UTTERLY ACCOUNTABLE TO US. WE PAY THEIR DAMN PAY CHECKS!!!

          GET IT GOT IT GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOD!!!

          HOW DARE YOU? HOW DARE YOU THINK YOU EARNED SOMETHING? WE GAVE IT TO YOU!!! AND IN MAY 2013 WE ARE TAKING THAT BACK!!!

          All the UDP GOvernment has done in their 4 years is:

          1) Abuse their powers

          2) Live the high life travelling all over the world on the peoples money

          3) Cost many local small business their businesses which has lead to UNPRECIDENTED unemployment by increasing fees at a time when they should have been offering businesses incentives in terms of concessions that they can pass on to their customers which would have lead to stimulated business activity.

          4) Throw away the countries money on:

          a) Cohen & Cohen

          b) GLF

          c) Paving of private/business driveways

          d) Nationa Building (Vote Buying) Fund

          e) Home Repair (Vote Buying) Fund

          This government has a track record of a train wreck. We truly need a wall of shame in Cayman. We recognize our heroes and we need to recognize our villians, how else are we going to get people to respect the law of the land. People of this type never find their way to prison because too many people are in their pockets.

          I think a Wall of Shame wouldmake politicians think about what they are doing and how if their actions are ever perceievd to do damage to the Cayman Islands their family could live with the stink forever. It would also haunt them for the rest of their lives. I know a little HARD LINED but we need change in Cayman because we are rampant with corruption and in all branches of government from the top right down.

          • Anonymous says:

            Anon 09;45

            You seem to be the smart pants. You sure can twist words around. Im sorry if i got your undies in a curl. Your respond shows so much anger.

            Get this into your head, the politicians, when sworn in, pledge their allegiance to the Queen, the Sovereign leader, not to you or anyone else.

            it's so easy to write shit….and you can sure write alot of it. Try  to understand that the ammended constitution 2009 made provision for district councils.

            These are the people you should be pointing fingers at,  the parlimentarians gave the green lights on this years ago, but most  are  too busy running their own  businesses, and can't seem to get  it on the road.

            When i said parlimentarians had no time to baby sit you or I, or to be personally accountable for you bucking your toes, they are too busy making laws, policies, and attending to  national issues.( mostly trying to bring the country's economy back in good standing)  Some of you curse them, and then turn around and want them to help pay your bills. I would'nt piss on you either.

            What you all should be promoting is a lower house like what the rest of the caribbean countries have. The lower house will have all the time in the world to meet with the people, and hear their   problems,  then they would lobby to Parliment. I must tell you, you are wasting your time waiting on direct consultation with your parlimentarians, and please don't tweak this statement around again, it is not goint to work for you. we are putting the UDP government back in.

      • Anonymous says:

        So i guess all the countries that use OMOV and SMC have true accountable politicians and we need to follow them..  WTF are you smokin?

        Cayman used to be the envy of the world, now we copying every body else and becoming just like them. 

        We had it made in the shade.  ONE TIME.

    • Anonymous says:

      I don't understand how OMOV divides the country. Please explain. A non response will speak volumes. 

       

       

      • Anonymous says:

        the islands are currently divided into 6 voting districts.  Under OMOV the islands  will be divided into 18 separate voting areas.  If you dont understand the meaning of divided, i suggest you look in the dictionary.

        • Anonymous says:

          Anon 1457 it is clear that you know how to add 2 + 2 and come up with 4.

          Congrats but you know that is not what that poster is talking about. The UDP is saying that the OMOV will devide the Cayman Islands into more sections and hence become more of a conflict within society. I guess there is a certain logic to it. I personally dont buy it but if you say so.

          Here is the thing. Cayman is hoping that this new system will cause the candidates to be more accountable I dont see it. I know the maths works fine but if you reduce the numbers of people voting for each candidate you also decrease the number of people he has to pay off to get into the house.

          Either way when after the votes are counted and everyone gets into the house, if Mac is in control and the elected members are in support of him he will do as he pleases. We still cant do anything about it until the next election. Perhaps a system needs to be in place whereby the people of the country might have the right to vote out the leader. It would be stupid to make just the elected members do so as they are all part of the same team.

    • Dred says:

      If that was the case maybe we should just get rid of districts altogether and just have it as Grand Cayman. Cause as you know Districts are devisive also. Maybe we should get rid of all the names on roads also and just call all roads McKeeva Street cause you know having names on different roads is devisive also. Hell why should we work at differentcompanies isn't that devisive also because well we are all shallow minded as McKeeva is and can not see that sometimes diversity is a good thing. and that there is UDP with no diversity of thought process. All following the same puppeteer Brother Jonesy offering his followers a steady supply of Coolaide. 

    • Anonymous says:

      And that accountability is born of a recognition of to whom one is accountable to ! You are totally off-base, clearly.

      Don't be taken for a fool by slick-mouthed politicians. Think!!

  43. Anonymous says:

    Ellio just seems to be Mr. Angry all the time. Even when he makes a valid point it is diluted because he just sounds so vexed at everyone. 

    • Anonymous says:

      He is an angry person and should spend some time taking care of that before he claims to represent other people.

    • Anonymous says:

      His boss likes him though.

    • Danonymouse Man says:

      Elio sounds vexed, angry and belligerent. I think he is cracking at the seams! He  had better watchout he does not have a stroke! This is no way for a young man to conduct himself!. Please someone needs to rescue him frrom himself and get him into some anger management. No wonder our young people are always in some altercation, after all their leaders coaches them right along!.

  44. Anonymous says:

    UDP money should have been used for this campaign. All the signs are even in their colours! We should not be paying for it. 

  45. Anonymous says:

    UDP mixed messages:

    One minute Ellio is toeing the UDP line which says that the system doesn't need to be changed and the next he is saying we need a national vote.

    Rolston said "raise democracy". How can democracy be raised if they want to continue giving some people more votes than others?

    Rolston also said "you will have access to all 15 members" but has used our money to advertise on signs that suggest those of us in MMC's will "lose some representation".

    I feel that (like it or not) they all represent me anyway so how can I lose some representation?

     

     

    • Anonymous says:

      Which proves what I've been saying all along.  They are clueless as to how much OMOV will help Cayman and its people, and would rather believe the cock and bull line Mac gives them than try to understand the clear benefits of OMOV.  

       

  46. Anonymous says:

    I have to agree with the author of the 809 post where it was stated about neither side has truly provided clear indications as to why one should vote YES or NO. Has anyone ever thought that the OMOV could in truth and fact prevent a voter from casting his/her vote. How? Lets say George Town is divided into 4 SMC….I am a voter in constituency #1 and there are 15 candidates running in that SMC however neither of the 15 appeal or appease me and I am not inclined to vote. Thus I am unable to vote as I cannot go to SMC #2….this is the real problem here that people are not being told the real and complete picture. This OMOV needs more time, dialogue and education. It is being rushed to the detriment of the majority of people.

    • I thought says:

      I though you were going to make sense then you rattled off some typical UDP garbage. are you really saying that you are unable to choose 1 person from a group of 15? If the person you want isnt running you find someone else who can do the job. The same thing happens today! Mackeeva is in WB so people in GT have to vote for Ellio or Mike.

       

       

    • MajorityRule says:

      Poster, you fail to recognize the basic underlying principles of democracy, which is majority rule and equality among all. Fair voting systems are designed to accomodate the majority, and cannot be custom tailored to an individual just because he/she prefers a candidate who is running in another constituency.

    • Libertarian says:

      Yes, but what interest do you have in SMC#2. Your home is in SMC#1. Look for example the United States, are you advocating that Floridians for the state of Florida should be able to vote for a next state's candidate???  Don't be scared of change, the one person one vote, has been practice from the time of antiquity.

    • anonymous says:

      Its the UDP government that rushed it….not OMOV committee. They asked for vote in November. UDP rushed it hoping to avoid it passing.

      However on your example…you can easily have that scenario now…you could have folks run in a district and not like any of the 4…same scenario.

    • Anonymous says:

      "or appease me"    How does that work now?  A fridge? a driveway paved?

    • Dred says:

      That comment is as stupid as you are.

      What makes your scenario so different from what we have now? I can still have 15 people running for BT who I could care less about. This has nothing to do with nothing.

      UDP is running scared.

      People Accountability is essential. Now because someone complains or suggest something to a representative does not mean it will get done 100% of the time. Because it does not get done does not mean therepresentative did not do their job. Their job is to bring the issue forward to the people who have the ability to affect the necessary changes. If it is deemed good and doable then it will be done and if not it won't. The simple fact is the representative did what they were asked to do. There are elements that affects ones job such as people, resources and funding that can literally mean success or failure that is outside the control of any single representative.

      UDP would have you believe that fairness is this.

      "If you vote for my messed up plan (scheme) I will allow you to get this done" is what we the people want. We have had too many of these messed up horse trading exercises that has led to our ruination today.

      On July 18th 2012 VOTE YES for your future and the future of your children.

      Martin Luther King said I have a dream. On July 18th we have the chance of making that dream a reality.

  47. Anonymous says:

    Personally I think the UDP made a huge strategic mistake by not embracing the OMOV and introducing the initiative into law. This would have portrayed them as a fair and right-thinking party and preserved their status quo and muted any possible opposition.
     

     

    By opposing the initiative, and then compelling the referendum to reach an unrealistic and unfair hurdle of 50% plus 1 of the total electorate they made a big mistake. Not turning up at the polls to vote has the same effect as a NO vote and everyone sees this as manipulation and underhandedness. In reality only the YES votes need to be counted to determine if the referendum passes, nothing else matters. Possibly this should have been anticipated in the constitution but it wasn't so we are stuck with this form of manipulation.

     

    Because of their stupid and transparent self-serving opposition to the initiative they have inadvertently created a large opposition group of bright, fair-minded people that can easily defeat them in the polls next year with only 50% plus 1 of the actual votes cast: A much lower hurdle to cross than in the OMOV referendum. This was incredibly stupid.

     

    Bush is very savvy and by far Cayman's smartest politician but this time he miscalculated. Even if OMOV fails the UDP will lose the next election since they have inadvertently created a cause celebrate that the majority of real voters will rally around.

    • Ike N. Sienow says:

      "Bush is very savvy and by far Cayman's smartest politician"

      OMG!  We're doomed!!!

  48. anonymous says:

    OMOV simply put:

     "Is it fair for one Caymanian on one side of a street to have 4 votes and their fellow Caymanian across the street to only have 3 votes or in some cases only one vote? ". That happens now under the current system.  How could that be fair and equitable??

    Also next week we all only have ONE VOTE to change our constitution why should we have a different system to select our representatives??

    Our CURRENT GOVERNMENT IS FOR INEQUALITY and for keeping some Caymanians different from others. Why don't the folks in George Town not have 4 votes because they live there?

    On Tuesday VOTE YES for making ALL Caymanians equal. Show the government once and for all that you do not beleive in divisive party politics.

  49. Anonymous says:

    The panel comes to discuss apples, and Ellio comes trying to sell oranges. Ellio, you need to get a clue and get with one of the programs. You are obviously not for OMOV, but you dont seem to be with the UDP mainstream either.

     

    So so sorry i voted for you, and believed all your talk and vigor. YOu have been a great disappointment to me as a GT constituent and as a citizen of Cayman. I expected you to be more of a man, and stand up for what is right for the Caymanian people as a whole, not stay silent or tow the party line and put party before country.

     

    You changed after you got elected. The allure of $$$$ has eradicated any good judgement and good sense you campaigned with.

     

    You will not be getting any vote from me in May 2013. Neither will Mr. Adam. I respect Mr. Adam but he is part of a greater evil that I would not wish upon the Cayman Islands ever again, so he will not get my vote either.

     

     

    • Anonymous says:

      elio will alaways find a way of not discussing the topic at hand…….

      its the only thing he is good at…….

  50. Libertarian says:

     

    MLA Ellio Solomon is all about a National Vote where the electorate votes from the slate of all candidates. So everyone will have 18 votes and get to choose who should be the countries MLA. He sings about how that will bring us more in unity. Really he is using the issue of the National Vote as an attempt to distract people from voting "Yes" to the one person one vote single-member constituencies. What he is hiding from the public is the logical conclusion that under a National Vote, George Town district and West Bay district having the most people on the island, will end up being the ones who will choose their own George Towners and West Bayers as the MLAs, because a National Vote means majority rule. It disregards electoral districts. So the Sister Islands and Outer districts will really have no MLA to represent them that has come from their districts. Under the one person one vote system, it will break the power of the majority into 18 times, the island will be divided into 18 constituencies, and this would allow the minority of each constituency to have more representation. Each constituency will consist of the range of 900 to 1000 persons and that would serve as a check against the tyranny of majority rule (at least for now until the population increase where you will need more representation and a bicameral legislature).  Under the one person one vote, you will see three things:  FAIRNESS, ACCOUNTABIITY, and definitely MORE REPRESENTATION (for minorities).  And let’s say we adopt Ellio’s idea of a National Vote, you will see three things:  NO FAIRNESS, LESS ACCOUNTABILITY, LESS REPRESENTATION, and may I add, the RULE OF THE MAJORITY excluding the SISTER ISLANDS and all other MINORITIES. And if we vote no and keep the system as it is, then we have failed to champion the cause of democracy, and that representatives (MLA) are accountable to the people. IF OMOV DON'T PASS THEN IT JUST REINFORCES GOVERNMENT THAT THEY CAN REPRESENT THE SPECIAL INTEREST INSTEAD WITHOUT ANY WORRIES OF THE PEOPLE OVERTURNING THEIR AGENDAS. That is why I appeal to all to go to your neighbors, people you know, co-workers, and reach as many people as you can, and tell them the truth about the one person one vote… still many people are not educated enough about it, and the current MLAs are determined to get back in… so they will say anything to get back in and they will even go as far as use government monies to campaign their cause and lie to you and distort the truth of what UNITY, FAIRNESS, ACCOUNTABILITY, AND REPRESENTATION really is. They try to redefine those words in the coming days. Don’t be bamboozled – VOTE YES TO ONE PERSON ONE VOTE!

  51. Anonymous says:

    I was at the debate last night. I must admit I left minutes after 10 pm before the end. I would have like to have asked this question, but time was short and there were many other very relavant questions. As a registered voter and a new member of the PPM party, I would like to see what our elected members will do to empower their 15,000 voters.  In a country with a popuation of around 60,000 and only about 25% are registered to vote, and those registered may choose not to vote, it is important that the 15,000 voters have power over their country and their destiny and not the other nearly 75%. Sometimes I feel like the foreigner and the minority. I am strong willed, but most Caymanians are not and easily pushed aside. In my place of work, I am the only registered voter and token Caymanian to fill the quota for the allowed work permits.  I am not being promoted, trained or encouraged to better myself or offered education. The work permit holders above me are given all of the allowances and benefits that should be offered to all Caymanians.  We are not given the same opportunities, but we are swept under the rug. None of the people I work with are smarter than I am. The present government system does nothing to empower me and my fellow Caymanians. Can the members who took part in the debate last night give an undertaking that the OMOV system will assist in empowering me as a Caymanian?

    • Libertarian says:

      You would be in a district of 900 to 1000 people, and would be able to have easier access to sit down and talk with your MLA. Your MLA would be able to conduct easier surveys of how his constituency thinks on certain matters, and he would be able to bring these matters up to the rest of the MLAs to be addressed and dealt with. That is what you call representation. Presently, we have representation, but the MLAs feel they are more accountable to Dart than anyone else.

    • Anonymous says:

      Smaller constituencies, greater contact with your rep and less chance he or she will ignore you. That’s it in a nutshell. More power to you and your neighbors.

      But also remember the other reps still will represent the overall district–as a GT, WB or Bodden towner the others have to help you anyway-you still have 4 reps from GT say. Right now even if you live in east end you still might go to Rolston for assistance. He is NOT going to tell you he can’t help you. His favorite example is the EE primary school expansion. So, they will have to respond to you more, can’t ignore you but your district still has the same number of reps.

      The fact is when they walk into the LA building they represent ALL Caymanians or at least they should.

  52. Anonymous says:

    The UDP is clearly only interested in retaining their own power.

    Otherwise they (as the Govt. in Power) would/could have brought their "concerns" of a change themselves. Instead they hijacked a Peoples Initiated Refferendum effort and have consistently attempted to introduce red herrings.

    I will be voting for One Person One Vote as it is the most fair system on the referendum question for 18th July.

  53. Anonymous says:

    Cayman is over governed.

     

    All it needs is 7 to 9 MLAs who elect a leader (aka spokesperson) from their ranks.

     

    Theirs is a strategic position. Their purpose is to define and articulate the long term strategic positions that will guide the country into the future. The civil service is then directed to make the strategy happen with political oversight but not political interference.

     

    The desire (not need) for 18 MLAs is driven by a culture of micro-management and over-control of the day to day operation of the government.

     

    For example, the Premier has set up his own "panel" for doling out funds for home repair. If this is a strategic direction for the country, then the doling should be handled at arms length by the Department of Children and Family services who already have that area of society well in hand. The Premier's micro-management style merely adds duplication and extra cost to the whole process.

     

    Downsize the LA in number and downsize its political micro-management culture and the country will be much better off. It might even evolve into a place where the government itself respects and adheres to the rule of law.

  54. Anonymous says:

    I thought Wayne was a bit benign and unprepared in his responses and tended to interject too many one liners and personal quips..He will most likely be good for the PPM, not that I ever want to see them in power again but last night's performance was weak at best! He needs to hone his own political skills and not try to be another Alden.

    • Anonymous says:

      It didn't help that he was sat next to a bully!  Next time they need to sit Ezzard next to Ellio.  Ezzard is more seasoned and experienced to handle the hot seat.  Wayne is genuine and I support him for election.

      • Anonymous says:

        If he can't handle the fire, he needs to stay out of the kitchen. I don't want any politician that every time he goes to a debate, he needs to ask not to be put by the sttrongest debater. If Wayne is going to do this, he needs to get some gumption about him. He is a trained lawyer after all and must have had some courtroom wrangling in his day.

  55. Bueller says:

    Wow. Can’t believe I actually agree with Ellio for once. I think we’d be far better getting rid of constituencies all together, have a national vote – everyone gets say 3 votes, and the 15 candidates with the most votes are elected. The 15 can then either elect which district they will represent (most votes gets first pick) or they can be allocated on the basis or which district gave them the most votes.

    This would likely end Hazzard and ‘Ardon’s political ‘careers’ though, so there’s no way those turkeys would vote for Christmas.

    • Anonymous says:

      That ridiculous suggestion was only given as a distraction.  1. Obviously smaller districts would go unrepresented since the entire LA could be elected by GT, WB and BT. 2. It would reduce accountability not increase it. btw it would be 18 seats in 2013.

    • anonymous says:

      Silly idea to distract you folks…sounds good until you think of it for more than a second…

      Cayman Brac, Little Cayman, North Side and East End will never ever be represented again in this system as thevoters in GT, BT and WB will far outnumber them.

      Even if 100% of the voters in East End and North Side COMBINED voted for SAME person it would take only 18% of George Towners to out vote them — and that does not even include West Bay and Bodden Town voters.

      Silly, distracting Idea. Not on Referendum. VOTE YES ON WEDNESDAY for true equality.

       

      • Bueller says:

        One of the 15 elected MLAs would represent each district. Your argument is nonsense.

        • Anonymous says:

          You just can't have random people represent a district, moron. The voters of the district need to have elected them in order for it to be democratic.

          • Anonymous says:

            Kurt has never lived a day in George Town but they vote for him every time…Gilbert was from Pedro, Bodden Town but he won in the Brac…Arden hasn't lived in East End in 20 years…

            Did I poke a few holes in your theory…Want some more?

            • Anonymous says:

              yep and Mike Adam has lived in West Bay for 20 some years and almost topeed the polls in George Town next to Kurt Tibbetts who is a transplanted Cayman Bracker living in Northward, Bodden town for near on 30 years.

            • Anonymous says:

              To Anonymous Sun, 07/15/2012-10:15             No you did not poke any holes in his/her  theory.You simply failed to address the point of view that they were elected by the voters in the district they wanted to represent.In other words ;Kurt was elected by voters in George Town ,and not by voters from Northward,or West Bay or any other district;Gilbert was elected by Voters from Cayman Brac and Little Cayman and not by people from Pedro; Arden was elected by voters from East End and not by voters from Newlands or any other district.Having someone assigned to represenct you and voting to have someone be your representative are too totally different matters..If you were facing serious criminal charges ,would you rather have a total stranger pick a name out of a phone book or would you prefer to pick John Doe who you know is a very good lawyer? I rest my case.

            • Anonymous says:

              Only the people of east end voted for THEIR representative. Where their representative lives has nothing to do with who they democratically choose.

            • Anonymous says:

              My point, which you seem to have missed, is that you cannot simply have a national vote and then randomly assign those elected to particular districts since the people of that district have not elected those assigned to them to office. Obviously Kurt, Gilbert and Arden were all elected by the people they represent regardless of whether they live in those districts. Got the point?       

          • Anonymous says:

            Calling someone – anyone – whom you disagree with a "moron" is not helpful and does nothing to bolster the integrity of your comment, indeed quite the opposite.  We have enough incivility emanating from the mouths of some of our present elected leaders as it is, and it is disgraceful. Please, let's not add to it.

    • Dred says:

      Hi Ellio….or is that Dwayne Sterling only idiots I hear supporting National Vote which basically means NO ACCOUNTABILITY AT ALL.

      Districts like East End and North Side and Sister Islands are UNREPRESENTED by anyone who actually gives a damn about their area.

      All MLAs will come from GT, WB and BT and all will be party people. Independent candidates will be a thing of the past. In a situation like this we may not see independent candidates running at all.

      National Vote is the most party centred system even worse that MMC.

      I pray we never ever see this day.

      I pray people who support National Vote ever get elected or in this case re-elected.

      VOTE OMOV – YES on July 18th – Make the dream a reality!!!

  56. Anonymous says:

    Still not sure of how I will vote on Wednesday, I decided to listen to the debate last night to try and gain for my own benefit a better understanding of the pros and cons of the OMOV argument. Having listened to the ramblings till about 10PM- I today am no further ahead than when I started to listen last night, I will say however- though I personally am still not fully sold on their argument, the government did put forward the most logical reason/s why they have objected. If one reads between the lines, the PPM (if Mr. Panton was representing their views) sames to almost be siding with the UDP that maybe the OMOV notion is not right for Cayman at this time. I honestly believe that the entire matter was rushed by both sides and that many voters will be disenfranchised as there is no real CREDIBLE arguments being put forward by either party as to why one should vote YES or NO. It would have been good to have an "UNDECIDED" box to vote as this would have been a true reflection of the feelings of the people as it is this writers conviction that MANY if not all who vote on Wednesday will be doing it along party lines i.e if your a PPM supporter you will vote YES and if you support the UDP you will vote NO. Change is inevitable and change is constant, but change does not have to be rushed!! At the end of the day- I have still not been convinced to vote YES or NO and might just do the right thing on Wednesday and relax in my hammock under my neem tree and let the rest of the country decide. And whatever the outcome- I will have to live with and accept it.

    • Anonymous says:

      Plain and simple – there are only PROS no CONS

    • Anonymous says:

      Not voting is automatically a NO vote. Unfortunately you need to make a choice. The UDP maneuvered you into this position and you should think about how you have been manipulated into voting NO when you are actually undecided. If you don’t like being manipulated then vote YES otherwise vote NO. You of course can stay home and automatically vote NO. The question is not that difficult, any person with Christian values should be able to decide. But unfortunately Cayman is not very Christian and it is not very fair. I hope you are really honest with yourself.

    • Live Free.... says:

      To Anon 0809. You said that you might as well stay home and relax in your hammock on that day of July 18 2012. Do you realize that this is the same kind of attitude of some of the Caymanians in 2009 Election, that have given way to this present Government (UDP) to run these Islands. By you staying home relaxing drinking Ice Tea in your Hammock, do you know that you just voted NO. For example, come next election some 10 Months from now, and you are not satisfied with this present Government, and you are not for PPM either. Are you gonna stay home and not vote? I been noticing this attitude and approach to election from register voters unlike yourself, thinking that staying home is the answer to your dissatisfaction of any Government of that day, is flawed, you just giving that Government one more vote to get back in, that is the same thing going to happen wednesday. Are you pleased with this present Multi Member constituents? if it's yes, then in that case you can go out and vote no to OMOV which I prefered used OPOV (One Person One Vote) or you can stay home which is the easy way of saying NO. But ifyou want to see a change in your representation and want more accountability from your representatives, go out and vote yes to One Person, One Vote, your one vote counts.

       

      Since You don't understand how One Man, One Vote works, I'm going to break it down in simplest way possible, bearing in mind a lot of Caymanians don't understand this simple system which I'm familiar with.

       

      Now You Have four people running for George Town in a Party, you normally vote for all  four of them in that party, because they campaign together in an election and they convince you that they are the best for your district and these Islands. And on that election day you casted your four votes. Now lets take these same four people and split them up in 4, Michael, John, Tina and Philip, they are all for the same party. Now let's us put Michael in GT South, John in GT North, Tina in GT West and Philip in GT East.

       

      Now you live in George Town North and you have 900 people living there, your Friend #1 lives in GT South 850 people, Friend #2 lives in GT West 1000 People, and Friend# 3 lives in GT East 1500 people.

       

      Example: What you have now is four people representing 4, 250 Constituents in total, by breaking them in four pieces as you can see, would give you better representation and accountability from your representive, because he only have to look out for 900 people in your area. The same thing would go for your other three friends, the smaller the number the better the representation, and you can hold your representive accountable much easier than what you have now.

       

      I hope my explanation clear up your understanding of One Man, One Vote, voting yes is my advice to you, not staying home. it defeats your rights to vote and having a voice in these Isalnds.

       

      One more thing if this system can work in Bermuda which is smaller than Cayman, and can work in other Countries bigger than Bermuda and Cayman put together, why can't One Man, One Vote work?  Multi Member Constituents (Block Voting) is the thing of the past, it's time for Cayman to step into the Futures, this is the 21st Century.

    • Dred says:

      Big Mac is that you? Or is this Mr Parchmentin takin the fall for you??? Or could it be Foolio or Hick Anglin…..or maybe Sacred Vessel Seymour….Go who could it be?? 

    • Anonymous says:

      I encourage you to restunder your neem tree

  57. Anon says:

    Trying to throw out other electorial systems this close to the referendum is just a blatant attempt to dilute support.

    UDP trying everything to stop the vote passing

    • Anonymous says:

      Perhaps some people feel like theY need more  time- some people learn slower than others and need more time to educate themselves on certain matters.  Please remember that the reason why it appears like this OMOV is being rushed on us is because The Premier and his UDP party hijacked the  the plans.  The OMOV committee were out gathering signatures on their petition to  present to the Premier in November, but to create a panic he (the Premier) decided to hold the Referendum in July. He is who should be held responsible for the Rush.  He deleberately did this to try to prevent the vote from passing.  Let us all SURPRISE HIM BY GOING TO THE POLLS ON WEDNESDAY JULY 18 AND VOTING YES YES YES!!  I THANK YOU AND FUTURE CAYMANIANS WILL RISE UP AND APPLAUD YOU.!!