No let up from Cayman ministers over gay cruise
(CNS): Church representatives are showing no signs of softening in their attitude towards gay tourism and remain opposed to the scheduled visit of Atlantis Gay Cruise Lines later this month carrying more than 3000 passengers. Pastor Bob Thompson, the chair of the Cayman Ministers Association, has said that the organisation had raised its objections to the ship calling to Cayman with the premier. On each occasion that a ship carrying passengers from the gay community has docked in Cayman the association has objected, and the minister said the position had not changed.
“The CMA does not support the permission for a gay cruise to come to our shores. Our motto is he hath founded it upon the seas’ and believe that should still direct our decisions,” he said when he spoke to News 27 yesterday about the ship due to come to Cayman on 21 January.
In the past, the ministers have staged demonstrations against the gay cruise lines including Cayman on their itinerary, making controversial headlines around the world. Cayman has found itself facing criticisms from gay and human rights organisations about the position the local church takes towards gay visitors.
Homosexuality between two consenting adults has been legal in Cayman since 2000. However, CMA and others still object to any kind of overt displays of affection between same sex couples. In May 2008 a 23 year old Massachusetts man was arrested at Royal Palms for kissing his partner on the dance floor. Aaron Chandler, 23, from Amherst, Massachusetts, had two altercations with a local who kept asking them to stop what they were doing before the police were called. As an activist in the gay community, the story spread quickly around the world and the Director of Tourism at the time, Pilar Bush, wrote to Chandler apologizing for what happened to him, an action which then drew considerable criticism locally.
During the country’s negotiations with the UK over the new constitution and the inclusion of a bill of rights the issue of gay rights dominated the discussions and the fundamental opposition to giving gay people any further rights and introducing any possible step towards same sex legal unions resulted in a watered down bill for all in order to get the whole constitution passed.
Category: Local News
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Homophobia = Irrational fear of homosexuality typical of those harboring secret gay desires
Re these preachers, "He doth protest too much, me thinks, constantly drawing attention to his secret obsession."
are you stupid or something….you MUST clearly be…god loves us because he made us BUT he does not love the life style we live..ie. Homosexuality. In the beginning God made what…Adam and Eve not Adam and steve so clearly he doesn’t LIKE that but it doesn’t mean he does not still love us…I can’t believe how ignorant people can be in cayman..Lets get up to date its 2010, so what just because everyone around the world is doing it we have follow them like sheeps, i guess if everyone in the world decided to jump off cliffs and the ministers were trying to stop it, you would still have stupid people on this complaining and being ignorant…
God help us all because it clearly shows that we need it.
Wanda Sykes gay??!! and I didn’t know that…she seemed so normal…my..my..my..oh lawd!! she seemed so "normal" I wouldn’t have known…..I have to smile…I see sunday school has taught us well, we haven’t moved beyond our last sunday school teacher, I see "my God", "my Jesus" my…friend in all matters" being mentioned…I’ve never seen more quotes about religion/beliefs in CNS than when it comes to gays.
Many posts are positive, even at the cost of being repetitive, but why so many posts regarding religion?
The murders/robberies recently in Cayman don’t elicit nothing near religiousness that this gay thread is doing. Think a little bit, go somewhere and meditate, quiet the mind. Does this say something to us?
Haven’t gays (and this is a modern interpretation(there has always been homoeroticism..human nature) and gayism (pun intended) is like a slide ruler, there is no defining where same-sex attractiveness begins and where it ends, that is what makes us humans…we are the only species that don’t have sex solely to procreate…we have consciousness, that’s why we think so much and create mechanisms to control that..i.e. cultural/societal rules to govern ourselves.
Most of us in the western world swallow the societal norms and tow the line, burying desires under the blanket of societal norms…a very few of us are 100% happy, marrying because of pressures, etc. However, some of us do find a very compatible spouse who turns out to be our very best friend and remain married for 25, 35, 35 and beyond years, that is very special and I applaud that. Really.
Then there are those that don’t make it through according to societal standards. Infedility, fed-up, tired, abuse (mental mostly) i.e. control issues, controling, selfishness, narrow-mindedness, jealousy (i.e.control issues), vanity, money, or lack of, step-parents, vindictiveness, pettiness, other issues that you can contribute readily contribute to drive us to destructiveness and separation.
I am not a negative person, really, but life wants to turn me that way. But I fight it, like many of us, I try to remain positive and keep my chin up.
Children are the future. Raise them right. Please!
The next 20 years many of our prejudices will be erased.
Gays are people just like me and you, they are good people who have suffered and have insight into many of societal prejudices..that’s why they make good friends, good people. Befriend a gay today,like Jesus would do…they have been through the fire of rejection, the fire of accepting themselves, the cauldron of being themselves if they have the courage to, it is a spiritual journey for them as it is for the rest of us….ahhh. this journey, no, this battle called life.
For what is this thing called life but a battle for spiritual advancement?
I hesitate to quote the bible, but it does have wisdom..
"For I reckon that the sufferings of this time are not worthy to be compared with the glory to come, that shall be revealed in us." – Romans 8:18
"It is through suffering that you will gain a measure of perfection." – Our Lady, September 28, 1974
These things I have spoken unto you, that in me ye might have peace. In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world John 16:33
“My peace I give unto you; not as the world giveth, give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid” (John 14:27).
My friends, be as God intended, may you find your spiritual path and develop. Peace to ALL.
We are all here on this earth a very short span, let’s enjoy and love one another. By hating we hold ourselves back. What is hardest to accept lets tackle it and understand it with compassion. OR AT LEAST TRY, God is a spark in all of us that we can kindle.
It is outrageous that these idiots (ministers) are still allowed to behave this way. Consider this. ‘he hath founded it upon the seas’… OK, so does that nean there are no gay sailors then, as in ‘ooo, hello sailor?’ Or would these bigoted facists turn away a gay paramedic, or a homosexual fireman? Studies show that banking and the police are statistically the most ‘gay-friendly’ employers… probably no ‘homos’ here then.! This behaviour by these supposed leaders is appalling, and I think, illegal. (please please please ‘bare’ with me, read on)
Definitions of seditious acts from the penal code:-
Section 57 (subsection 1d) says ‘to raise discontent or disaffection amongst the inhabitants of the islands’
Section 57, (subsection 1e) of the Penal code says that ‘an intention to promote ill-will or hostility between different classes of the population of the islands’ (The penal code defines ‘public’ or ‘population’ as ‘all person in the islands…’)
‘different classes?’ That’s written IN LAW? WOW!
Section 58 subsection 1 (‘god’ bless it) says:
Whoever-
a) does or attempts to do, or makes any preparation to do any act with a seditious intention;
b) utters any seditious words;
..is guilty of an offence and liable to a fine of one thousand dollars AND to imprisonment for FIVE YEARS and any seditious matter shall be forfeited to the Crown.
BUT IT GETS BETTER….
Given the shocking display of appalling bigotry that accompanied the last ‘gay cruise ship’ visit, consider how this next section might have applied, or even how it may apply when the next ‘pink’ ship visits….
Section 68 (1) says:
When three or more persons assemble with intent to commit an offence or, being assembled with intent to carry out some common purpose, conduct themsleves in such a manner as to cause persons in the neighbourhood reasonably to fear that the persons so assembled will commit a breach of the peace, or will by such assembly needlessly and without reasonable occasion provoke other persons to commit a breach of the peace, they are an unlawful assembly.
subsection (20) says:
It is immaterial that the original assembly was lawful if, being assembled, they conduct themselves with a common purpose in such a manner as aforesaid.
When an unlawful assembly involves a breach of the peace or terror to the public, it becomes a riot….
The punishment for an unlawful assembly is imprisonment for one year (Section 69 amusingly) and the punishment for being involved in a riot is two years imprisonment (Section 70)..
VERY INTERESTINGLY, Section 76 says:-
All persons are guilty of an offence who, being riotously assembled unlawfully and with force prevent hinder or obstruct the loading or unloading or the sailing or navigation of ANY ship, hovercraft or aircraft…
Section 88 (b) says:-
Whoever-
‘with intent to alarm any person, … commits any other breach of the peace’
is guilty of an offence and liable to imprisonment for THREE YEARS, or if the offence is committed at night, to imprisonment for FIVE YEARS.
Where was ONE anti-homophobic arrest when the last ‘gay’ cruise ship visited Grand Cayman (interestingly both officers involved have since been removed from the force) and local police stood by while the arresting officers fought with the suspect who was aggressive and resistant…
So premeeerBush, did you’re trip around the world say ‘bring your business to Cayman, so long as you’re not a poof?’
The behaviour of the ministers is outrageous and illegal, DO NOT endorse it.! Mr Baines, I challenge you to ensure the Law is enforced on the next occasion, WITHOUT FEAR OR FAVOUR!! My advice? Care, Listen, and Act!!
He hath founded it on the seas? what does he mean by ‘our’ motto? i think he should read ‘hello sailor’, a history of the tradition of gay life at sea, or ‘onthe seas’ if you like…
Here’s a review from Amazon….
"When gays had to be closeted, ships were the only places where homosexual men could not only be out but also camp. And on some liners to the sun and the New World, queens and butches had a ball. They sashayed and minced their way across the world’s oceans. Never before has the story been told of the masses. These are the thousands of queer seafarers, mainly stewards, who sometimes even outnumbered the straight men in the catering departments of ships that were household names and the pride of the fleet. Hello Sailor! uniquely shows what it was like to be queer at sea at a time when land meant straightness. "
Way to go pastor Bob. !!
Ha! Ha! Fallen Angel, I couldn’t agree with you more! I’m going to crack open an Amstel Light right now.
Bean Bag, you came in late – I’m already nursing a humongous hangover.
Peace, everybody! God is Love. He said, ‘Love your neighbor.’
He also said, ‘Love your enemies.’
Perhaps because they are one and the same?
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Go on Nicky, post this!
CNS: Ummm….no. But I had my own private chuckle.Thanks!
‘God is great,
beer is good…..
and people are crazy!’
pam pam pa pa pam….
What scare me about these religious folks are them wanting to make and enforce "religious laws" for ALL CAYMANIANS, claiming that all in Cayman are "Christians" – hence, everyone must comply with these laws…
Hey, revelation! Bob must be gay too because he cant make children…….make you wonder, no?
I think the problem is the attempt to enforce spiritual rules in a secular world. Oil and water, both necessary, but the two just do not mix – and people wonder why there is so much backlash. I have a pastor who gives the admonishment – "You are so Heavenly bound that you are no earthly good" We will get to Heaven in God’s time but for now we have to live and be productive in the world.
Not oil and water, Frank. Light in a world of darkness. In the longer term the darkness wants to snuff out the light. As an intermdiate step the darkness wants us to hide our light so that we can have no impact upon the darkness. We must therefore be silenced on social issues. We on the other hand want to increase the light.
The problem with your position is that you believe that you have a monopoly on defining light and dark and having defined them, that your morality, based on these definitions, is absolutely correct.
I simply do not accept this. I do not share your definitions of light and dark, nor do I share your code of morality. Neither of us is right nor wrong, although I suspect one difference between us isthat while I accept this, you are ideologically incapable of doing so.
I do not question your right to have an opinion on social issues and to promote your moral code. This is a positive position in my book. But unfortunately your argument crosses over into negative territory when you tell others that their moral code is wrong and their lifestyle choices unacceptable. Where you say " We on the other hand want to increase the light, " I see only a perpetuation of darkness which has existed through human history, the imposition of one person’s belief system and moral code on another.
I am not pro-gay, anti-Christian or amoral. I am simply pro-choice when it comes to humans freely following a lifestyle which is in accordance with the man made laws of the society within which they live.
What is right: Seeing, Love, and Understanding
What is wrong: Not seeing, Self-centeredness, and Ignorance
But does right/wrong has anything to do with BELIEF?
How can it when belief has to do with the mind? You can believe in anything?!
Cryptic!
As an aside O’Really, somone I work with is convinced that you are me. Can you please confirm to them that you are not me, just to settle the issue. Thanks!
I feel your pain at being mistaken for me, but I am definitely not you as I would have put an "e" in "someone"! The real O’Really.
O’Really, I appreciate your courteous response but we’ll just have to agree to disagree. You believe in moral relativism, but I do not. Woe is me if I fail to bear witness to the truth. Christ has brought that light. It stands to reason that you will only see a perpetuation of darkness if you are not in the light.
Gospel of John
"Life was in Him, and that life was the light of men. That light shines in the darkness, yet the darkness did not overcome it. There was a man named John who was sent from God. He came as a witness to testify about the light, so that all might believe through him. He was not the light, but he came to testify about the light. The true light, who gives light to everyone, was coming into the world…This is the verdict: Light has come into the world, but men loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil. Everyone who does evil hates the light, and will not come into the light for fear that his deeds will be exposed. But whoever lives by the truth comes into the light, so that it may be seen plainly that what he has done has been done through God."
Fair enough.
CAYMAN GET OVER YOURSELF !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It is 2010 The rest of the world is up to date you are leaving yourself behind.
Hahahaha lmao lol case close!
Dear Cayman Islands Ministers Association,
We humbly praise and applaud your stance against the abominations on ships that would attack your country. Although we worship within different faiths, we do acknowledge that we serve the same God, blessed be his name. Our God, the God of Abraham, the same God revered by the people of the Book, knows your actions. He is proud of your stand against those wretched souls who dare love eachother.
Even as we struggle in jihad against imperialistic enemies, we take this time to say that we are with you in spirit. You, the Cayman Ministers Association, are true men of God. We look up to you. You make us proud and you inspire us to fight on and believe in the coming of a better day on Earth when God will have his way.
We stand as brothers with the Cayman Ministers Association. We could not agree with you more. We must follow God’s word and reject those who are not like us. Everything the Cayman Ministers Association stands for, we stand for. Our theological differences are small compared to all that we agree on.
Peace be upon you all. May Allah continue to bless you in your fight against gay inavders.
Sincerely and in Great God’s service,
The Taliban
(Afghanistan)
I would like to know what God you are worshiping? It’s surely not our God! For God is a God of love and not hate! Please study your history before you pass judgement unto others!
For God is a God of love and not hate!
Maybe let your CMA know that then , LOL
as for history, read this and then pass judgment (know your history to avoid repeating abuses)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_Inquisition
Typical rose tinted Christianity
Read your old testament – your loving god kills crazy numbers of kids
Even the loving Jesus advocated beating slaves
Try reading the whole bible, not just the bits that suit you
It always amazes me how many times this God orders the killing of innocent people even after the Ten Commandments said “Thou shall not kill”. For example, God kills 70,000 innocent people because David ordered a census of the people (1 Chronicles 21). God also orders the destruction of 60 cities so that the Israelites can live there. He orders the killing of all the men, women, and children of each city, and the looting of all of value (Deuteronomy 3). He orders another attack and the killing of “all the living creatures of the city:men and women, young, and old, as well as oxen sheep, and asses” (Joshua 6). In Judges 21, He orders the murder of all the people of Jabesh-gilead, except for the virgin girls who were taken to be forcibly raped and married. When they wanted more virgins, God told them to hide alongside the road and when they saw a girl they liked, kidnap her and forcibly rape her and make her your wife! Just about every other page in the Old Testament has God killing somebody! In 2 Kings 10:18-27, God orders the murder of all the worshipers of a different god in their very own church! In total God kills 371,186 people directly and orders another 1,862,265 people murdered.
The God of the Bible also allows slavery, including selling your own daughter as a sex slave (Exodus 21:1-11), child abuse (Judges 11:29-40 and Isaiah 13:16), and bashing babies against rocks (Hosea 13:16 & Psalms 137:9).
http://www.evilbible.com
Thank you for your reverred support. We have already studied your book and are training our stingrays as suicide bombers in case these heathen same sex lovers enter our waters.
Allah be with you.
CMA.
"Aah, now come on my Caymanian people leave the gays alone, for they bring so much joy and excitement to the party lol."
We all have choices in this life and the choice we all choose will follow us. I’m hetrosexual and I don’t hate nor discriminate, for everyone of us deserves to be happy in our own way!
So to all the gays you keep doing your thing, and avoid all the negativity around you. Love makes the world go around and gays make it more merrier lol. Spread the love and stop the hate! Learn to appreciate more people.
What ev er happened to believing there will come a judgement day and you will one day meet your maker??? Well guess what Cayman Ministers get over yourselves your not it….
I can’t believe this is happening again! Because gays are so much fun to be around, I can assure you, there will be some heterosexuals aboard this ship. Who knows, maybe Rosie O’Donnell, Wanda Sykes, or Ellen DeGeneres will be on board.
I think it is a mistake to try to ban this ship from docking. With the unemployment rates in the U.S. many people are not vacationing. The Christmas purchases was mainly by foreigners. That’s right! On the local news here in the U.S., they interviewed people from China, Canada, Europe, Philippines….everyone were taking advantage of the sales….they also filmed some of the foreigners at the airport with loads of goods where they said they came just for the shopping. Had it not been for these shoppers, of course, all stores would have reported disappointing sales.
I grew up with the belief that it was wrong and strong dislike of gays, all due to my christian upbringing. I had to learn on my own this was wrong. I have a couple of gay cousins, and I have a few male gay friends – and believe me, I wouldn’t trade these guys for anything in the world. I can always count on them for almost anything. I am female, and I have had better friendships with gay men, than I’ve ever had with females. What can I say, women friendship has a lot of ups and downs – jealousy, arguements that turn into grudges, sleeping with friends boyfriends….
Is there an active trade in gays now? Might want to pick up a few for my collection…
actually, Ellen deGeneres and her wife were on Island over X-mas! Guess the church had not noticed and they slipped through the cracks!
"Slipped through the cracks"…
Now THAT cracks me up!!!
Consenting adults, twenty first century vs dark ages, yada, yada, it’s all been said millions of times.
But what’s wrong with their money? Has the exchange rate between Gay Dollars and ConformingToCurrentCulturalExpectationsInTheirSexLifeOrAtLeastPubliclyPretendingToBe Dollars dropped lately or something?
Creeps like this keep me away from organised religion.
The Cayman Islands Ministers Association (CIMA) is trying to speak for all Christians and this is wrong. They don’t represent me, for one. Why aren’t they speaking out against the drug dealers, users, prostitutes, adulterers,etc., who sit in their pews every Sunday? Is it because they give money when the ubiquitous offering plate is passed? Hypocrites! Leave the tourists alone. Especially cruise ship tourists; they are here for just a few hours. With the state of Cayman’s economy, maybe they will spend a few dollars with the locals. Who knows, maybe a few of those dollars will end up as "tithes and offerings" in the local offering plates on Sunday. Will this money then be returned as "tainted" by sin? Makes you wonder…..
Reminds me of other island leaders. They speak for everyone and represent a choosen few. Why aren’t they speaking out against the goverment waste, non performers, no responsibility, and incompetence in their ranks? Is it because these same people gave them their very lucritive lifestyle?
Sounds like they worship at the same altar. O wait … they do!
As scary as the pastors are, think about what sort of people look up to them, follow them, and hang on every word they say. That is truly terrifying.
I heard one Cayman pastor call in on the radio today and calmly explain that groups such as gays can only grow if they recruit.
Oh vey…
Another victim of self-lobotimization called in to say that gays clearly choose to be gay. He "knows it for a fact."
Mmmmm…..
Seriously folks, does Cayman have a school system? What in the hell happened to these people? Can we help them? Unna go ahead and laugh but these people need immediate intervention by professionals.
A word to those who claim they are Christians: Love your neighbor as you love yourself. Do you love your neighbour? Probably you don’t whether your neighbour is gay or not, so take the plank out of your own eye so you can see more clearly to remove the spec of dust in other’s eyes, as Jesus says all this to do. Remember he gave the 2 New Commandments, to love God with all your heart, soul, mind, body and spirit, and to love your neighbour and in so doing you will keep all the other Commandments by keeping these New 2 he gave. So, remember that what you input here needs to be input in the spirit of God’s True Love for everyone, if it is not spoken with true love from your heart, then be careful you have brought judgment on your own self, for Jesus says, whatever measure of judgment you use against anyone, will be used against you. Fear God. He who has no sin cast the first stone, remember, they all had to put their stones down and walk away, cause there is none without sin, all have sinned and fall short of the Glory of God, that is why we need the Saviour, Jesus, the only one who can save us from our sins. What would Jesus do with the gay cruisers??? He would preach to them and show them their sin and error, but he would do it in his perfect manner of love for them in his spirit of Mercy and Grace. Remember the song, :Thy lovingkindness is better than life." Remember his loving kindness and his love for all people, it is not his will that any should perish, but that alll would come to salvation in Him. Not that all will, but he wishes all would, but he gives all free-will to choose whether we want eternal life in Glory, or eternal torture in the burning lake of sulfur. This we all have to choose for ourselves individually, no one can choose for anyone or make anyone choose what they don’t want to choose.
Remember Christians, we are the hands and feet and lips of Jesus here on Earth. Please remember Jesus before you rise up against the gay cruisers, it’s not about yourself, it’s about Jesus. What would Jesus do???
Can anyone say whether the UDP changed the PPM’s policy, which was announced by Mr. Clifford back in 2006.
At that time Mr. Clifford said that the Cayman Islands would not discriminate against any of its visitors or residents on the basis of their religion, race, sexual orientation etc.
Can someone enlighten me please…..cuz McKeeva said he was against this PPM policy and that he was "born again"…..Hmmmmmm………..
This thread has drawn so much attention it makes me wonder if there is anyone on these islands that dont have some form of gay tendency. Those in favour of the gay life style is certainly being allowed to have their say, yet very little is being posted from the anti-gays.
The same seems to be reflected in the poll so could my theory be right??
I’m a Tri-Sexual, I’ll try anything once. You never know until you do. Youmight just like it.
So your saying that if your not against Gay people than you must be a "little gay? Which means if you not against straight people you must be a "little straight?If your a man and not against women than? Boy are you messed up. Are you currently in prison? Another reason to add to the obvious that internet access should not be given to those in prison. Ever! Anywhere!
I share the cell next to you idiot. Thats why you get put in jail, so that you can learn about homosexuality.
Thats not me in the cell next to you but keep dreaming. And thanks for proving my point.
FACT: A significant majority of posters and voters condemn homophobia especially when incited by pastors twisting and distorting Christianity.
CONCLUSION A:
As suggested by Anonymous above, the vast majority of posters have "a gay tendency".
CONCLUSION B:
As suggested by Wanda, the vast majority of posters think bigotry is wrong and the CMA are out of order.
Forgive me for stopping my post here, I need to go back into my closet.
Come, come, now Wanda. Come out of your closet – the truth shall set you free.
Well well here we go again with the Pastors Association and hate filled words and talking hyprocrisy now isn’t that funny. They call themselves children of God and practice not what they preach. Remember a gay person is a person and has emotional feelings just like you and I so don’t go ranting about them as if they are wild animals. Let’s look at crime, rape, drug, domestic abuse and over development as our main areas of concern and not what 2 people choose to do in theirprivacy. I see it that there’s a bar and a church on every corner in Cayman and seems like the Pastors are in it for the money. I say start reaching out to the community become more involve and think that what if your child is gay now how would you feel knowing that they were discriminated against.
Those of youwho accuse the Pastos Association of hypocrisy for standing up and defending the christian heritage of this country simply do not get it; would’nt it be more hypocritical for them to pretend to welcome these people here knowing that they do not agree with or encourage their lifestyle?
Too funny. With everything else that is going on THAT is what they should stand up for? Perhaps they should focuson aiding the needy, helping to set up some sort of after school programs to keep yout off the streets or provide supervise homework for children whose parents either don’t care or can’t because of their work schedule. Why focus all of their attention towards something that lasts a couple of hours a couple of times a year???
Yes, it is hypocritical, and if I read one more time about the Christian heritage I am going to gag. This is the only place where this is continously rammed down once throat whenever it suits.
Despite what all of you bloggers are argueing about. The truth can be found in the true book, the BIBLE in 1st Corinthians Ch. 5 thru 10. The good LORD will be the judge of all men. Please do not condemn our Pastors, they are just the Messengers. Condemn those of you who are guilty of the acts and please do accept the fact that the acts are all wrong.
Your magic book also says you are supposed to kill gays (Leviticus). So, are you prepared to commit murder for your retarded worldview? Stop selectively quoting your silly book.
Do the world a favor, shut up and go flog yourself.
Hey El Stupido… read the whole bible and stop picking yourself. That (Leviticus) was old Jewish law… has nothing to do with Christianity.
Bible doesn’t say about not eating seafood… there is reference to food with shells but not seafood in general. That, however is also thrown out the window when Jesus says all things are clean to those who are clean (my paraphrase).
Love God, Hate Sin!!! That simple folks. Don’t hate the gay people, hate the sin instead.
Hmmm… "Love God and hate sin."
So, does that mean in hating sin, we must literally and deliberately stop gays or sinners from visiting a country or Island?
I think gays should do as they please, so long they do not cause harm on anyone or threaten their well-being. They must be punish like everyone else if they assault or harm someone. But as long as you and I want to be free in society, gays should have that freedom as well.
Fairness is a universal principle from the throne room of God! Thus, to be unfair is sin!
The bible also condones genocide and says that no one should eat sea food. the wonder of Christianity ‘the true pick and choose religion’!!!
Hypocrites! That’s what the Cayman Pastor’s Association is. Name me which pastor does not own an expensive home, has an expensive car, or can afford to travel extensively, etc. The only true pastors are the ones that have nothing because they do it from the heart, not from the tithes that some people struggle to provide. Pastors, please focus on helping people, especially within your own families, some of whose children are seen with liquor bottles in their pant’s back pockets! You know who you are. I stopped going to church because of all this hypocrisy. All they care about is the money they get and the poor stupid people comply. I choose to honour my God privately, without the middle man there waiting to take my money.
Let GOD alone judge the Pastors or anyone else – He’s the only one that can judge us – HE said "judge not that ye be not judged" Show me one person on this earth who is not a hypocrite – follow the footsteps of Jesus instead of others whom GOD said "your righteousness are as filthy rags"!!Please don’t be a coward and let others keep you from Church!
Simple: Hate is Hate – Period.
Bad manners are bad manners – period.
If you find yourself spouting anti-whatever rhetoric (take your pick: gays, expats, Caymanians, religious group, nationality etc.), you are betraying the principles that any major religion espouses, as well as principles that thoughtful atheists or agnostics profess to live by. You’re living a lie. You have issues within yourself that require attention and you’re being rude.
You might argue that there have to be standards… No argument there. Trick is to be brutally honest with yourself and separate stuff that you don’t like or approve of versus stuff that actually affects you or your loved ones, and what you can control or help change in a positve way.
Using the topics mentioned here: Can someone’s gay lifestyle REALLY have any effect on you? No. Does gang/drug violence? Yes. How about adultery? Child and/or spousal abuse and domestic violence? Both yes, for the incredible immediate and long-lasting effectson a family and trust, and by extension, society.
"Live and let live" does not mean allowing stuff to happen to you – a wiser man than myself wrote that "The freedom to swing your arm stops at my nose…"
That motto implies responsibility on both sides, and restraint. Stop yourself before you say or do something hateful, and politely challenge someone who slips and spouts/does that crap… And if you are called out – don’t get defensive, but stop, and think [gasp!]
Yes, this is a repeat of a comment I left elsewhere, but it bears repeating…
Kudos to CNS and writers here for encouraging civil conversations, versus the unproductive shouting that seems to happen elsewhere…
I am not prejudiced but sometimes things are taken too far in the defence of so called rights. Please believe me when I say that these Christians can do whatever they want behind closed doors, but why do they fell the need to shove it down our throats? I don’t want my children to be exposed to these people and their views.
Do your children watch SPONGE BOB???? If they do you better stop them from watchingbecause if you haven’t realised it yet this is a gay cartoon. Sponge Bob and Patrick!!!!!!!!!! Your kids dont need protecting from these types as you call them. And what would your kids be doing in town when the cruise ship comes in anyway???
You didn’t read my post properly – I was talking about not wanting to expose my children to Christian fundamentalists. We all love Sponge Bob.
To all those posters who are trying their hand at satire, first try reading Jonathan Swift’s "Gulliver’s Travels" or Orwell’s "Animal Farm", both fine examples of allegorical works. Your posts are at best sarcasm, long considered one of the lowest forms of humour.
Personally, I find nothing funny in the article being discussed. It is a sad statement on the views of many of Cayman’s preachers and some of its so called Christians. What is particularly sad is that Cayman would like to portray itself as a Christian country and this is the way that they choose to do so. Many of the gay people that the CMA are seeking to keep out of Cayman show more Christian virtures than the preachers themselves. How about putting your efforts into feeding the hungry, tending the sick and helping the oppressed? Gays are in all of these categories, especially the last.
There has been a lot of talk about everyone having a right to their opinion and I would be foolish to argue against that. However, is it right to use a position of influence to prejudice the minds of others? Unfortunately, many believe these preachers to be messengers of God and cannot distinguish between God’s message and and the preacher’s own bigotry.
A few posters have commented on the need to protect our children. Do you really believe that seeing gay couples will make your children gay? If so, turn off your televisions, disconnect their computers from the internet and lock them in their rooms! I am gay and I am a father. My children who are now grown have always known and none of them are gay! My lover and I have baby-sat my nieces and nephews and to my knowledge not one has turned out to be gay. So, why do you believe that just seeing two men or two women together will make your child gay? Maybe what you really are afraid of is that your children will be more tolerant and less bigoted than yourselves! If there is a "danger" to children it is to the ones that know that they are "different " from the others. By seeing other gay people they learn to accept themselves and not feel so alone in the world. They learn that they do not have to lead lives where they have to hide in fear of being discovered or discriminated against. In other words, they learn that they too can be happy, productive members of society. A society that I hope Cayman will one day be, where everyone will be judged according to their worth and not according to their race, religion or sexual orientation.
Personally I would start the suggested reading list with Aristophanes. I love Gulliver’s Travels, but find Animal Farm a little too childish and obvious (although ideal as an introduction to analysis for our sarcasm/satire impaired American cousins). Sarcasm is an integral part satire, to distinguish the two is to misunderstand satire. For example A Modest Proposal is heavily sarcastic – and no-one can pontificate about Swift and satire unless the have read that text.
All things being told – get off your high horse.
Its amazing how the anti-gay sentiments resemble the anti-black, segregation and african dicrimination that existed in the past. The bilble was used to condone slavery and it was also used to convert Africans into servitude. I say this to say these ministrers embody the same hypocrisy and sentiments like the slave owners of the past. Using the bible as a sword to fight against one’s sexuality is wrong and its no better than past events. If these people want to be queer they should be given the right to do whatever they please and wherever. So if you are against racial discrmination you should not be for a discrimination of sexuality. They are similar: people, different from others, they stand out, they want to be free as such should be allowed to indulge in their "queerism"
Your comparison is not quite fair. If I am anti-cannibalism am I discriminating? We just have to accept that there is a legitimate claim that homosexuality is not as nature intended. Without using any biblical verse, the fact remains that humans can only recreate when a man and woman complete the act as nature intended.
I do not discriminate against gays, but I do not appreciate the lobbyists trying to change school systems to teach ‘alternative’ lifestyles
Nearly all animals can only procreate via heterosexual couplings, yet there are many documented cases of animal (particularly mammal) homosexuality. And that from species we deem to have little other than natural instinct. So how is it you think that human sexual preferences are not as nature intended, but rather some conscious decision?
And furthermore, I don’t quite understand why such sexual preferences are such a big deal. Personally, I find many of the heterosexual fetishes found all throughout society to be far more distasteful than homosexual acts. I mean, who are we kidding that an act of sex is intended to procreate in the first place? Half the time it’s an unintended byproduct of an act undertaken solely for pleasureable purposes.
As for lobbyists and all that jazz, I would much prefer children are taught it doesn’t matter who their parents are, so long as their parents love and care for them. Wouldn’t an alternative scenario where a child was raised by loving parents (regardless of their genders) be a very refreshing lifestyle from what we currently see?
If humans are of nature then homosexuality is as nature intended. There is no legitimate claim which upholds that homosexuality goes against nature. In fact, homosexuality has been observed in many other animals, not just humans. Animals are of nature and love is deemed natural. If a man/woman is barren and unable to produce a child is that not an act of nature? Otherwise, they should be ostracized in the same manner as gay people because they are unable to "complete the act as nature intended".
You assume that nature intends for every act to be one with seemingly logical intention/s (just because you think you see all the results does not mean that you see the whole truth or the truth at all). As an example of this thought process you believe sexual intercourse is for procreation…well, it is also a means for 2 persons to bond emotionally. An emotional bond (i.e. what we experience as love) between 2 persons does not take away from a social group but adds to it because you’ll protect the group in order to protect the one you love. It is not merely for the purpose of procreation and thus not restricted to being enacted solely between a man and a woman.
Goodness! If we could only get the same amount of response to our poor and dwindling education system and our increase in violence and gang warfare and we would be sooooooooooooo much better off as a country. We always seem to focus on the wrong things. It never ceases to amaze me the amount of hits the usual non-sensical diatribes of Caymanian vs expats, gay and whether there is God arguments can get, but the truly hard hitting and important issues in our society always seems to fall on deaf ears.
As a society we have soooo many more glaring problems to worry about before they fester into really monumentous and insurmountable problems. Let us work together as a society and tackle the problems with our education system and our youths first please!!! If we think crime is out of control now just wait until this latest batch of bitter, angry, desensitized to violence and uneducated kids graduate from school !!!!
Enough of this nonsense man!!!
CNS:
I don’t like the position of the man’s hands in the little ad flashing at the top of the page. What kind of message is this sending to our youth? That it’s ok to show affection? We don’t even know if they’re married!
Joe you are no doubt joking but actually the juxaposition of the two photos and their respective positions does seem sexual. Probably a subliminal advertising message.
I am not prejudiced against fundamentalist Christians who hate homosexuals, rather I view such hyper religiosity as a disease of the mind, often induced in childhood when these poor souls had their minds warped when they had no free will. . . Twisting spritual doctrine into hate is a choice and it can be cured by exposure to religious leaders who understand Christianity and are not influenced by the fundamentalist movement so prevalent in fly-over America.
Killers, Drug Runners and Greed….
There are plenty of sins and sinners running amok in Cayman. Maybe the Church going Bible thumpers should look at focusing their worthy efforts on getting the Cayman House sin free before worrying about visitors? Heysus, we have fellow Caymans being killed and robed on our own little Sodom and Gomorrah, so before we star casting stones….
you know of any gays committing murders and rapes and hit and runs on island. why dont the church make a stand against all these people instead?
( no im not gay )
Oddly enough…. this is my pastor and I love him dearly.
HOWEVER- separation of church and state should still stand and therefore if it is legal to be gay in the Cayman Islands then let the gay cruise dock in Cayman and enjoy our beautiful waters and spend their money!!
I wish there was less hate surrounding all of this- what do they think we might catch some gay if we let them dock??
It is a simple human rights issue and anti-gay is another form of discrimination… if this was 80 years ago they might have been protesting against an all black cruise and my position would remain the same.
God said love one another…. not love them if they are interested in the opposite sex.
Gay’s have been around since the beginning of time. How else would you explain the wide range of homosexual dinosaurs like the Lickalotapus and Megasauras??? Take it the way it is, they’re here, they’re queer, and they’re pround of it.
Have you ever stopped to think that maybe it’s "they’re here, they’re queer, and they just want to live a normal life regardless of their sexuality so please see them for the people they are and not only their sexuality?"
Strange, the God I know loves everyone whatever their sexual orientation. Maybe all of you who hide behind God should just come out and say you are against homosexuality instead of using God as a crutch for your opinions. I do not agree with you being against homosexuality but you have a right to have an opinion; you just don’t have the right to try and shove your beliefs down everyone else’s throats. Oh and by the way, if you do any reading of proper scientific research data, gay men are not any more likely than heterosexual men to commit pedophilia. That is a myth only believed by those who want it to be so. Maybe it’s time to quit using God and religion as a crutch for your own personal bigotry and hate agendas. And churches wonder why their congregations are shrinking. What about having the same outrage for rape, sodomy, child abuse, underage pregnancy, marital infidelity, unprotected sex, and lack of parental responsibility, etc. that exists daily in the Cayman Islands? I never read about the Cayman Ministers Association speaking about any of those things in the media. A bunch of hypocrites. The best thing the CMA could do is avoid George Town the day the cruise is in town and not embarass the rest of us who they do not represent in any way.
On The Gay Cruise Ship. I would like to know why it is that people are afraid of this ship, as if we do not have gays in Cayman Islands. We would be shocked to know that more than quarter of the Cayman population is an open Gay or Closet.
In the churches we have Gays, in the supermakets we have gays, they trim and style our hair every day, they teach our children at schools, policing on the streets, and cook that nice jucy steak when ever we eat out.
I am talking real life now….. We are not going to get rid of them, because many of them are our husbands and boyfriends,uncles, brothers and children. on the down low, like you dont know what that mean; !!!!! its just that we dont realize it yet.
Why a person prefers to be that way I do not know, but they are our family, best friends and our neighbours, pot an bottle washers, cooks and dish cloth, with a big heart . Have we questioned ourselves why are we acceping the adulterer, and the fornicators but making no fuss?
I would like to know if it is more sinful to be an adulturer, fornicator or to be identified as Gay? .
On our church choir we have gays, fornicators, and adultures singing on Sunday mornings its just we are not sure who they are. We need to stop being hippocrites about gays. If we do not have anything to worry about , then why are we afraid of this Gay cruise ship?.
I truly believe that the church should take a firm stand on all the evidence they have that is against Gods wishes,and stop being bias. When all the killing of our young people was going on, I never heard a word from the church.
Sorry to say but the churches need to stop playing church and take sin by the horn> Stop making a fuss over this Gay cruise. Go about your everyday business, take to the higways and byways and try to win souls. Too many people are putting on Sunday best takng up spac e in thehurch for the wrong reasons.
Keep praying but please stop saying that Cayman is such a Godly place because, Our hearts are hardned and it is not true.
More than a quarter of the Cayman population is gay?!? Is there something in the water?
Maybe they have caught the gayness.
Twyla, you mention every group of people having gays among them (even the church) but you did not mention Politicians. There are 15 elected MLAs so going by your calculations there has to be at least one gay in the house – NO?
The CIMA should hold a mass demonstration when the ship arrives and block any tenders that try and land anyone.
Why is it that if I am against homosexuality I am referred to as a homophobic as if I have some kind of ailment? It is an opinion and I should be allowed to have it. I don’t think being homosexual is a born condition, I believe it is a sickness and even more sickening when they try to promote it as an ‘alternative lifestyle’ which is exactly why Gay cruises are organised. Our children deserved to be protected from this kind of thing and that is why I support the ban on gay cruise ships calling. Gays are a part of our life and have been for centuries and I have nothing against them, only when they organise themselves in this way. And to all the proponents of homosexuality not being a choice, I would argue the same must apply to pedophiles too and we protect our children from them.
You are very homophobic because you believe in something that is widely disproven. Further, they are not organizing… they are going on a vacation! Have a heart.
er duh – If gays are going on a gays only cruise that is organized!
If you’re thinking organized to mean having some hidden agenda then you are wrong. People go on gay only cruises for the same reason they go to a gay bar – it offers the freedom for you to be you without other persons judging you for your sexuality. You’re at ease and more comfortable because you do not have to worry about homophobic criticism or being beaten up just because you’re holding the hand of the person you love. You’re around people who accept you and don’t hate you. There is no nefarious reason.
For the same reason being against women is sexist, and against black people racist – of course this is on the premise that homosexuality is not a choice.
I know! Why is that as I don’t like spiders I’m called an Arachnophobic.
I don’t think being homosexual is a born condition, I believe it is a sickness
and your proof is what? if it’s a sickness where is the bacteria or virus?
why are some animals homosexuals?
Too funny
and "gays" have been part of life for thousands of years, not hundreds
You are so ignorant i actually feel sorry for you. What a terribly sheltered worthless little life you must lead. The scariest part is that you probably have about 6 children and fill their ears with drivel like this.
Why is it that if I am against fundamentalist Christians I am referred to as prejudiced as if I have some kind of ailment? It is an opinion and I should be allowed to have it. I don’t think being a fundamentalist Christians is a born condition, I believe it is a sickness and even more sickening when they try to promote it as an ‘alternative lifestyle’ which is exactly why churches are organised. Our children deserved to be protected from this kind of thing and that is why I support the ban on churches. Fundamentalist Christians are a part of our life and have been for centuries and I have nothing against them, only when they organise themselves in this way. And to all the proponents who say fundamentalist Christianity is not a choice, I would argue the same must apply to pedophiles too and we protect our children from them.
Where does the above post mention Christianity?
You have interchanged the word homophobic with prejudice out of context and therefore invalidated your argument completely. If one is against Christians the proper term is anti-Christian. Prejudice is a general term homophobic is specific to homosexuals – QED
My guess is that you are gay, and hate yourself for it, and that is why you think about gay people all the time.
Personally, I am straight and have kids and could not care less what willing adults do with each other. And thus, I almost never think about such things except when I read rubbish like this on CNS.
However, if I heard their was a pedofile in my neighborhood, I would have no problem chopping off one of their limbs.
Then you area poor parent indeed. If you chopped off the limb of a pedofile in your neighborhood, guess who’s side the law is on? You would go to jail and then what would become of your kids? If think this is rubbish why are you both reading and contributing?
I noticed that you didn’t try to refute the posters notion that you are gay.
How can you be so sure that gay people are not born that way. I know a boy here who has acted like a girl since he started primary school. This is obviously not something he chose and i’m sure he gets hell at school over it. I think some people choose to be gay but some like that boy are born that way. I think he will have to struggle all his life with the way he is. I know of other gay people here who have a terrible time, one has tried to commit suicide on at least one occasion. I’m not condoning the gay life style but I can’t hate all gay people because they are gay. I think many of them struggle with the way they are. I think weshould be more focused on trying to do something about gangs, murders, armed robberies etc.
Are we not are all sinners who have all fallen short of the grace of God. Didn’t Jesus tell those who had committed no sins to cast the first stone at the woman who committed adultery? Of course, no one did. We all sin and those of us blessed enough to have a relationship with God should be praying for those who do not. These people are visitors to our Island and should be treated with respect. Every last one of us sins every single day. Those of you who dont think you do, need tolook at yourselves. They are God’s children just like us. I think God hates all sin and I don’t see anything in the Bible to say there are varying levels of punishment for various sins. He had to send Jesus to save all of us and does not want us to judge each other. Not only is homosexuality a sin, so is adultery, incest, stealing, murder, gossip, slander, coveting our neighbour’s possessions, etc. etc. If all the sinners leave Cayman – guess what, it will be empty. Stop worrying about petty things. None of us really know who will go to heaven and who will not. The Bilble says put God first, then love our neighbours as ourselves because we are not perfect either and what a truly wonderful and unique place Cayman would be then!
As a Christian, I ponder this… why is it that Christians feel so strongly about this issue, but not as strongly about other "sins" or "abominations"?
I’ve come to realize that most people address this issue out of a disgust for an "act", rather than researching the scriptures for yourself. Reminds me of when a child goes "gross" when they see a boy and a girl kiss. If you’ve researched the issue for yourself and still come to the same conclusion then fine, but what I experience in this issue is that people respond out of ignorance, or worse, what other people say, rather than knowing for themself.
There are many scriptures that are used to "clobber" gays, with 6-7 key ones that are repeatedly used. If we are going to use Leviticus, then we need to seriously protest clothing stores (selling dual fiber garments), Fosters, local restaurants, farms… THEY SELL PORK AND LOBSTER. Not to mention that there is a restaurant on the island that is sooo ungodly that they have the name… LOBSTER POT!!! Ohhh the abomination. ((sarcasm folks, just trying to stress the mentality that abounds))
((sarcasm continues, though true)) Not to mention the fact that we shake hands everyday at work or on the streeet and vote in people that sin! ((sarcasm ends here))
GREED, GLUTTONY, WIFE BEATERS, TAKING THE LORD’s NAME IN VAIN! NOT TO MENTION INFIDELITY and DRUNKINESS!!! I have them in caps for emphasis, not judgement.
Why not protest the high level of infidelity in the island. The gay cruise ship will come and go. The infidelity is here to stay it seems. I have my own opinion on which is more harmful to the Caymanian family… Infidelity!!! Where is the balance? So much crime going on and not a word. But here we have a gay cruise and you would think that Alicia Keys was coming! Oh, sorry, she did come… nobody obviously has a problem with the fact that she sang a song with Jay-Z where Jay-Z totally disrespected Jesus Christ. And she was welcomed with open arms to this "christian" country. Christians taking pictures with her all star-struck. What gives? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0dApiC2-l04
Not to mention the fact that people who aren’t even Christian "get religion" and use it as a weapon against gay people, yes, HUMAN BEINGS.
So my question is this… what is it about this issue that ignites us so? Why aren’t we as passionate about other sins as we are about this? Is it because if we saw it as another sin then we would be forced to see that gays are human beings just like us? And I’m sorry, I pray that God searches our hearts and reveals to us the truth in our hearts when we use the "hate the sin, not the sinner" line. I’ve heard how some people talk about it and trust me, you need to confess that you would not hold a gay mans’ hand in public and pray for him.
I genuinely want to know… from Christians, what makes homosexuality the most detestable thing to you? Check your emotions when it comes up.
Pondering.
CNS I have to disagree on the last comment re the Constitution. The Bill of Rights is not watered down, it is simply not what you wanted, so it is unfair to say it was watered down simply because you (and others) didn’t get what you wanted.
The controversy as I remember it was over the sectionagainst discrimination. The wording is the same wording in the EU Convention, except our wording actually goes further than theirs. The second part of the controversy was whether the rights should be free-standing or not. The legal device that makes them free-standing has only been signed and ratified by a third of the EU countries. Quite a few of them have not signed it mainly because they do not know what the ultimate effect of signing will be, they don’t know what it will do, how it will play out, whether it will crate mass expense or take them down a road that their citizens do not agree with, so they have held off.
That is not watering down, it is stepping carefully. So it is unfair to say that Cayman, taking the same decisoins that many European countries have taken, has watered the document down to get it passed.
But what the CMA and politicians did not understand was that it does not matter what the Constitution says. If the Governor signs a law that is short of the rights under the ECHR in respect of an individuals relationship with the Cayman Islands government and the FCO does not stop him then disadvantaged individuals can sue the UK government for breach of the rights, as free standing rights under the Human Rights Act in England. And after a damages claim or two against the UK gov the laws of the Cayman Islands will always be checked for compatibility going forward. So we all have the protection of free standing rights.
I disagree. The UK has gone no further than we have, so why does that not happen in England now? Why don’t people sue the UK Government for falling short of the ECHR? Because the UK Government hasn’t fallen short of the ECHR. It has merely refused to accept a later protocl that was optional.
The UK government is sued everyday for falling to conform with its ECHR obligations through the Human Rights Act which gave a statutory cause of action for harm caused by infringement of those rights. And since it also applies to actions of the UK government outside Great Britain and Northern Island, a failure by the UK to prevent non-compliant legislation coming into force in Cayman would give rise to a damages claim under English law.
Christian response to homosexuality. Many of the comments on this topic show a real misunderstanding of what Christianity is. Firstly, Christianity is about love, because God is love and the greatest expression of love that He gave was His son Jesus Christ as a sacrifice for our sins. Being a loving God does not mean that He will simply be tolerant of anything that we want to do, which, if you read closely is really what many of the commentors here really want – to be allowed to do whatever we want, never facing judgement, or consequences. He cannot tolerate sin, He has to wipe it out, that is why He sent Jesus to take the punishment for it. If He were to tolerate sin then He would not be God, becuase His very being is sinless.
Tolerance is a word that gets misused nowadays. We say we should be peaceful and tolerant of eachother, and that is true, however there is a big difference between tolerating a person and tolerating what they do. I might tolerate my cousin, but not the fact that he steals, for example. Christians must be loving of others, but love is not avoiding confrontation at any cost, nor is it ignoring truth so that we don’t offend others, or feel uncomfortable ourselves. Sometimes loving someone requires that we have to say and do things that hurt them. Like when I had to be sent to my room for misbehaviour, missing my chance to go to 12-mile banks with my dad, or when I have to turn my cousin in to the Police for stealing, so that he will face consequences and straighten up.
While I am sure soeone will say that the example is different from homosexuality, for a Christian it really isn’t. That is the crux of the matter. Our belief systems are different, we believe one thing and others believe something else and we both accuse the other side of being wrong. Eventually we will all know the truth, but for the timebeing we struggle with this tug-of-war of opposing views.
Christians must oppose homosexuality because God opposes it. Yes He is a loving God, but He does not accept sinful behaviour, and there is no possible way to misinterpret what the Bible says about homosexuality. God loves each gay person as much as He loves anyone else, but that is not license to commit gay acts, it is Him loving them in spite of their sin, just like he loves me in spite of my sins. But He has made it quite clear that His loving us will not give us a free pass so that we can go on sinning. It’s like being friends with your boss and constantly messing up, blowing deadlines and not performing your work. The bossmight like you, but if she is a good boss, she will not tolerate your under-performance, and will take appropriate action. The appropriate action against sin is death. That is why Christ came, to die so that we would not have to if we accept Him. If we make Him our Lord, then our sins are covered by His sacrifice. And just as He rose from the dead, we will rise to be with Him for eternity. At the end of the day that is what all of us really want underneath anyway, to live forever!
I pray that those who need to see this will and will gain a spiritual understanding. Again it is not that Christians hate gay people, it is that we have no choice but to recognize the act as sinful.
So what’s the big deal about a gay cruise ship? Gay people come here all the time, that is true. But a gay couple coming here is a gay couple coming here. They are in a state of constant sin because of the homosexual union. We see them, recognize immediately what it is, and move on. But a gay cruise ship is a celebration of homosexuality, something completely different. It is more than just people sinning, it is a celebration of sin, that is why the CMA opposes it.
People have a lot of hateful things to say about the CMA, but they have a job to do. I also see comments about money-grabbing and hypocricy. It is amazing how these comments of money-grabbing preachers, obviously references to USA, have as of late been twisted as accusations against local pastors and stated with such authority, as if those making the accusations know for fact that pastors are stealing money, and speaking of things that they buy etc. Those are lies and those of you doing that know that you have not seen anything that you could use to substantiate your claims, you are simply repeating cliches and hoping that they stick. Look at our pastors and see how they live, they aren’t stealing anyone’s money!
Finally, the only difference between a Christian and a non-Christian is the acceptance of Christ. None of us is without sin, we all have fallen short. But we know what sin is and must move against it. It is not hypocricy for me to tell you that an act is sinful and then I commit the act, no more than it would be hypocritical for me to tell you that you should not speed and then I speed, those are a measure of weakness/susceptibility to the same temptations that you are suspectible to as human beings. Hypocricy would be for me to tell you that there is nothing wrong with speeding, – because I know that that rule exists. You could also look at it as if I am telling you best-practice. I may know what best-practice is, and so I tell you, if I am not using best-practice in my company am I a hypocrite for sharing my analysis? No, for whatever reason (poor management most likely) my company is not there yet, even though I know the best-practice that I should be achieving now. It is the same with Christians speaking of the things that God has classed as sin. We know how dangerous it is because we have experienced what it does.
I hope that the explanation and examples I gave will help others to understand, but at the end of the day, what makes us all Christians is not logical explanation, but a life-changing encounter with Christ, that is what I pray for all of you. Grace and Peace to you all in the name of Jesus.
So many people have died ans suffered in the name of Jesus. Think very carefully on your position. Jesus loves homosexuals and all of the disenfranchised. Be carefull about assuming that you may interpret his will and enforce his law.
what did jesus say about homosexuality?
How sad. The previous poster is a typical fundamentalist Christian who doesn’t even understand their own religion.
The person wrote:
"Many of the comments on this topic show a real misunderstanding of what Christianity is. Firstly, Christianity is about love, because God is love and the greatest expression of love that He gave was His son Jesus Christ as a sacrifice for our sins."
Oh really? Christianity is about love? Tell that to the 70-90 percent of people who you believe your god tosses into hell for eternal torture. Hitler gave more people a pass than that. All the people in that hell you believe in aren’t feeling the love, are they?
"He gave his son Jesus as a sacrifice fo our sins."
How warped is that? First of all, God didn’t sacrifice anything because he was Jesus. He sacrificed himself? Huh? If you let people kill you but they don’t really kill you, it’s not really much of a sacrifice, is it? If you are confused, read up on the Holy Trinity and if you can make sense of the whole "big Jesus sacrifice" please enlighten us.
Furthermore, why in the hell did anyone have to be sacrificed for "our sins" anyway? What sort of barbaric nonsense is that? This is all just a more intense version of animal sacrifice. It’s stupid. What sort of god is it that you believe in who has to set things right with a human sacrifice? Think about that.
And why in the world would any believe that people are born with "original sin"? What a terrible concept: "Everyone is flawed and evil straight out of the game, so we need a human sacrifice to clean everyone’s slate."
A baby is born with a criminal record? What a sick belief. No wonder so many fundamentalist Christians are so quick to hate others.
This would all be funny if it weren’t for the fact that so many people take it seriously and act insane as a result.
Forget gay people, you have bigger fish to fry. Do some deep reflecting on this strange belief system that you have hitched your wagon to. Actually read the Bible and be honest about the blatant insanity that it contains. Ask your preacher meaningful questions. Do that and you are sure to see that you have been bamboozled.
Well said! I completely agree. Thank you.
This is making me proud to live on Cayman. There is a consensus that we should live and let live. But… we have to take Christianity seriously because many of our friends and neighbors take their particular religion seriously. I believe in freedom of worship. But it becomes so difficult when hypocritical wack jobs like Ted Haggard in his shiny suit, gold watches and fake credentials and others expound virtues they feel in no need of themselves. They prey on people….our friends….and our neighbors. That doesn’t make their beliefs any less important or sincere. It does however bring into question how religion is used as a money making venture for some. The purpose of any ministry is to guide people in their quest to be closer to God and more God-like themselves. Not to issue ultimatums based on personal fears and prejudices. Many ministers fall short of that and confuse their views with the teachings of a Compassionate Lord. They put their own interpretation on the Bible and call it The Word.
Then pass the plate for donations or put a number on the screen.
We should never confuse guilt and fear with belief and being righteous. Or allow others to give direction to our own hearts. It’s very simple…if it doesn’t feel right in your own heart….it isn’t.
Ps. The God I believe in has never been short of cash.
I would like to state first and foremost that I am religious, I believe in God, and was raised Catholic, a religion known to have no tolerance for homosexuality. However recently I heard a sermon by an elderly Catholic Priest who spoke of acceptance and love and how he learned from an experience as a child that in his opinion God meant this should be extended to all! I was not alone when leaving the Church with the feeling my mouth was hanging open from what I heard. Nor was I alone when I realized that a weight had been lifted from me because my church was progressing, was changing with the times and being more accepting which is the true message they always preached. Now they were starting to practice what they preach! Jesus in human form reached out to those that were shunned and considered the greatest of sinners and He did this openly and whole heartedly and we are taught that we were made in His image and should strive to be like Him.
No matter the religion, the fact that we are all people of God seems to be a universal belief. God doesn’t turn his back on his people.
That being said, I agree with the ministers and pastors who don’t think the gay cruise ships should come to Cayman….. but not for the same reason.
I remember the day that a gay cruise ship came to the Island and people were protesting, screaming out that gays would burn in hell etc. Anyone who walked downtown that day in a same sex pair would have been assumed to be gay and there were many other cruise ships in that day. Many mother and daughters, friends, fathers and sons etc would have been assumed to be gay and treated poorly. This display was a disgrace to an Island that calls itself religious. In my opinion and that of many around the world Grand Cayman Island disgraced their people that day. Many of us felt shame over what happened in Georgetown that day.
Religion should mean acceptance and open arms to those that may be sinning. That means all of us as we all sin at one point or another – even men and women of the cloth! How dare a person of sin openly shun and shame someone else who they feel is sinning? Key words "they feel"
I don’t read and rereadthe bible and am soooooooo far from being zealous in my religion but am of very strong faith.
I do however remember something very important in the bible though that seems to apply here
"Let those who are without sin cast the first stone." It seems there were a lot of stone throwers in Cayman that day – most of whom threw stones in the name of God. Not sure he’d like that but I am sure He’s forgiven because that is what He does
Acceptance, forgiveness and open hearts will bring one closer to God, not condemnation of sin as we have not been placed on earth to judge.
I don’t know why the people on the ship would even want to come!
Re: "I don’t know why the people on the ship would even want to come!"
We don’t! We are angry at our cruise line for keeping this port of call! We are all happy to visit more friendly places. But since I am forced into this, I am going to pray that the Caymanians will be civil.
Keep in mind that you can’t be selective with tourists like us. We have enormous numbers of friends who love us and once we decide that the Caymans are a backward and dangerous place, tourism will be decimated.
I wish these protesters knew me personally rather than assume I am an animal.
Dear Friend,
You’ll find that the CMA is a lot of bark but no bite. While I find their opinions and actions deplorable, I do hope that you will enjoy your time in Cayman regardless of some of the ignorant and bigoted comments you have seen here. I hope you find that on the whole, we are a welcoming society and want that you come taste our food, partake of our beaches and generally have a great experience.
See you soon!
I just wish that the CMA would take alot more time on the story of all these people being killed on our islands. Forget what type of people come here. It is accepted in the states now, and many countries all over the world. Would you like them to stop you from coming into their countries? USA? ENGLAND? SPAIN? or wherever it may be. Leave these good people alone. They want to come and spend their hard earned money with us. They want to sit on the beach. They want to swim with the stingrays. Let them be.
Why not take the same time, if not alot more time, comforting these families that have lost a son/daughter? Comfort them. Come onto Cayman 27, Radio Cayman, and preach that this is wrong!!! Have you ever spoken to any gang members? Have you ever gone to the prison and preached there? Trying to get ‘them’ to change their ways? Do you go to schools and preach there? There are more important issues than not wanting a cruiseship of GAY people here.
If you took even a small amount of the time you do on this topic, and put it towards helping our youth from travelling down the wrong road, we might even have one or two lives saved. You just never know!! And neither will we.
Much like Ted, the first thing that came to mind after reading John Smith’s rambling commentary (far below) is that he is gay. He has to be; no question about it. John, the best thing that you can do for yourself, your family, and the Cayman Islands is to admit it. First to yourself, then to your family, and then to the world. There is no shame in it John, and nobody will judge you. Best of all, you can have your "special friend" from the States, Bob, come visit on occasion. No reason to "hide" Bob any longer. Good luck John! just mac an cheez
Now we shall here all of the Ministers become vocal. They sit there and say nothing about the serious rise in violent crimes and armed robberies (the issues which urgently need to be addressed), but with a gay cruise is coming it will become hard to keep them off of the airwaves and from issuing statements.
To the CI Government: FOCUS ON WHAT REALLY MATTERS. Is a gay cruise of the upmost importance? No, it is not. The cruise ship coming here does not affect our daily lives, it does not bring negativity and will certainly not stop many visitors from coming. However, fears of being shot or robbed in broad day light might have an impact on tourism!
Cayman is so, so very twisted. (Sigh)
When will the Church realise that the prevalance of Adultery in these islands is MUCH more damaging to society that the "threat" of homosexuality. I understand even the bible they choose to boost understands that….is it not one of the ten commandmants…check how many times adultery is condemned and shown as wrong compared to homosexuality….also note the distrust, broken homes and damage that adultery leaves behind in society!
It continues to amaze me that the Church and other religious entities/ individuals are the first ones to jump up in opposition to a gay cruise comming here, yet, they call themselves Christians?
I do remember the Bible saying to "come as you are". And if you do believe homosexuality is a sin, are we not all sinners anyway? Christianity is about accepting ALL people with open arms. It is not about descrimination. Sad that a few bigots and ignorant people manage to tarnish a religion which aims at protecting peoople, and not attackign them.
Cayman is full of ignorant people, and sadly I do not think this will change anytime soon. Grow up and open your eyes Cayman. Knowledge is power. Ignorance is bliss.
Yours Truly,
A Concerned and Embarassed Christian
Did you forget about Sodom and Gomorrah..Gen 18-19? Or is that too old Testament for ya?
I do agree with one point…We are all sinners! Question is though, are some sins punished more severly than others? Reason is if I recall Abraham was trying to bargin with HaShem about destroying or not destroying Sodom where his nephew was. Hard", and small a number, as he tried to find that were "righteous", it still couldn’t save them for a specific practice.
My Christian friend…lean not on your own understanding. Pillar of salt for those who look back (miss/accept) such practice
Some people really need to make up their minds whether they are following the entire bible, only the old testament or only the new testament. The old testament has a lot more supposed sins which the majority of so-called Christians do not follow.
Furthermore, I was just wondering, what relevance does the old testament have to Christianity? That portion of the bible pre-dates Christ, yet Christianity, even the word ‘Christianity’, is based on Christ. The word ‘Christian’ means a follower of Christ. So, are portions of the old testament followed because it happened to be lumped in with other writings when the bible was created (perhaps, the editors of the bible thought that the new testament alone made the bible too short so they needed a filler)? Christ being the son of God technically has the most credibility when it comes to saying his words are that of the Lord. May these pre-Christ ‘prophets’ actually be false? Maybe someone can enlighten me on this, because I really don’t understand.
The answer is not in Christianity religion or any faith; the answer, my friend, is in your heart and your heart alone. Even Jesus said, "the kingdom of God is within you." The Buddha taught that we must seek within ourselves if we really want to attain liberation in this life and the next
CNS: Can you please put up a poll so that the people of the Cayman Islands can let the outside world know that the majority of us are not a bunch of bigotted hicks?
CNS: OK. T’is done.
Thank you!
The Church is a dying institution, people are starting to catch on
“The CMA does not support the permission for a gay cruise to come to our shores. Our motto is ‘he hath founded it upon the seas’ and believe that should still direct our decisions,”
?
Just a minute.
Well that makes perfect sense.
For a minute I thought Pastor Bob didn’t have a clue what he was talking about. Now I’m certain.
Yo Bob: I don’t care if someone is gay or not… Like most of us I’m just glad they’re happy.
John Smith is the most entertaining poster on this board, although probably not for the reason he would like.
I got a few laughs by the completely moronic, silly and non-sensical comments throughout the chain.
I take it you must be high, intoxicated or gassed most of the time if you only got a laugh out of Mr. Smith’s letter. I am straight but I know people that are gay.Mr. Smith your letter was most needed in this forum. It clarified a lot of questions in my mind. and I realize now that Homosexuality is wrong, and it is abomination before God. I’m going to invite some of my gay friends to accept the lord at church this Sunday.
And afterwards invite them back to your place for a bit of "heterosexual" bonding.
Can I come too?
Well in 2006 Minister Charles Clifford allowed the gay cruise to visit Cayman because he understood the negative impact on the tourism business that the 1998 homophobic letter from the then Tourism Minister caused.
Mr. Clifford successfully repaired the Cayman Islands image overseas by declaring that the Cayman Islands would not discriminate against our visitors on the basis of their sexual orientation or otherwise. Mr. Clifford understood clearly the fact that these visitors are high net worth individuals.
Following this approval by Mr. Clifford there was a significant increase in visitor arrivals in 2006, 2007 and the first half of 2008. In the second half of 2008 the recession began to bite and the numbers began to recede again.
But I recall Mckeeva Bush accusing Mr. Clifford & the PPM of having an anti-christian policy at the time because they allowed this ship to visit.
Well Mr. Born Again McKeeva – Why didn’t you use your Mighty Premier powers to stop this ship from coming to our shores.
The view is very different from the drivers seat eh McKeeva !!!!
AH !!!!
AMEN!
God bless The Chuckster !!!
maybe now that the view is very different from the drivers seat, especially if it’s RED in color, he will support this cruise ship visiting our shores? Before, he was not in a position to stop the gay cruise, but now that he has the authority to stop this one, but won’t, have we stopped to think for a minute that he does NOT want it stopped? THINK!!!
"Ted Haggard is completely heterosexual""
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HZmHC75FDqQ
Very funny
“The CMA does not support the permission for a gay cruise to come to our shores. Our motto is ‘he hath founded it upon the seas’ and believe that should still direct our decisions."
Well that makes a lot of sense. For a minute, I didn’t think Pastor Bob had a clue what he was talking about. Now I’m certain.
Yo Bob: I don’t care if someone is gay or not… I’m just glad they’re happy.
Ah here we go again!
It just becomes more clear each time these shameful charlatans called pastors rear their ugly heads to address the gay issue, some or all of them MUST be gay themselves…the classic "pulpit syndrome" – if you hate something with such venom as Thompson/Ebanks/Sykes do, there just HAS to be some filthy thoughts of hot guys in their minds to be so hateful towards their "brothers & sisters"
"He hath founded it on the seas" = Classic line
Let’s entertainthe notion that a big old bearded man in the clouds created Cayman & put it in this special place..
3Things: Plate Tectonics, Migration & Slavery? How else did we/you get here?
Are you saying that there were no gay people on the slave boats? None in Africa? None of our ancestors? Hatred of gays swept the globe with the growth of Christianity as it was not too much of an issue to most civilised societies.
The manipulation of Caribbean/African American/African minds by "whitey" fascinates me…"suffer now & the promised land is yours" – how easy this is lapped up!
This is a civil rights issue but so many of you stay silent – shame on you for your own son or friend is probably too afraid to tell you
1) Homosexuality is NATURAL – to those sharpening your machetes, you are ignorant enough so pay attention: Natural means ‘part of nature’ and there are thousands of documented cases of gay animals, especially mammals – which you are… like it or not…
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_animals_displaying_homosexual_behavior
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A8k5d1jVuQ0 – a lighter but factual look
2) You may think you are special/placed here by your amazing god who loves you (but hates others) & answers prayers (but not others) but just as you would rely on the science of DNA to catch a criminal, it is now accepted fact (mostly by people without imaginary friends of course) that we ALL originate from one tribe in one place – AFRICA. I am not ashamed, I am proud to be an African Ape & certainly not ashamed to be related to a monkey/rat/tree/whatever..
http://www.boingboing.net/2009/05/05/new-genetic-survey-h.html
One would think that when we have mountains of evidence for these 2 facts, that the issues of Racism & Homophobia would be finally erased, as it’s clear we were all once one tribe & a lot darker than we are now …but some of us moved about (some by force, hello caribbean) a bit & here we are : some with pale skin & hairy arms, others dark skin no hair – all adaptations to our environment – but no..who benefits from the masses not getting this message at an early age? Oh yes, the CHURCH & it’s criminal ambassadors, the pastors on their 15%, nice cars, trips away, nice houses, and in some cases mistresses/boyfriends & gambling habits
Only last night i passed a few hundred people in a field being warned that the world is ending very soon, how shameful these charlatans are – I "pray" for a society where these liars & brainwashers are criminally charged. One recent charlatan was even called Brother Cash!
I "pray" for some investment in education here as this way it’s going to take a long time to wipe out this cancer that Cayman has, it’s better than Jamaica of course but it doesn’t look good when the Deputy Leader says the moon is less than 2000 years old! Oh your kids are going to do so well
Come on people RAISE YOUR CONSCSIOUSNESS – READ A BOOK FROM THIS MILENNIA! FREEDOM FROM MENTAL SLAVERY!
Here endeth the lesson. I love "the gays", it means more girls for ugly guys like me.
If anyone would like to challenge the CMA to a debate/protest these morons let me know!
Peace & Love to all x
Why is it that every time a gay cruise comes to the Cayman Islands, this same group of people make a big deal about going out to meet them? Are some of the folks the local version of Pastor Ted Haggard, who denounced gays while at the same time is gay himself?
With tourism on the downward slope and businesses crying out for customers, do people really think that Cayman can afford to be picky about who comes ashore on a cruise ship??
Well, statements made by the CMA such as this one just confirms again that I have made a good choice of being a god believer, but not a member of a church. I do not want to subject myself or my family (especially my children) to such hypocrosy. It used to fascinate me when I went to church and saw the wife beaters, druggies, thieves, cheaters etc etc. being holier than god himself.
Find something worthwile to do CMA, for example, why not save some starving children, or go out an help rebuilt someone’s home.
There is an evident outpouring of condemnation of the actions of CMA from the educated, intellectual, gay and straight Caymanian population. I am a (full bread) gay Caymanian who is appalled at the continued closed mindedness of the CMA. I am one of the many Caymanians who are currently overseas perusing an education and in a matter of a few months of being away it has become all too evident that our “beautiful, rich islands” are in tremendous need of major human rights development. We are proud to hold our head high and brag of our high GDP and excellent standard of living but our respect for our fellow human beings is a complete disgrace, comparable to 3rd world countries!
Answer to M. Lite,
Support your statements with hard data! Who did your research? A. Hitler? My only reason for replying to your idiocy is that there are most likely others out there equally or more stupid than yourself.
I am a gay Caymanian and yet I have never heard of a gay coterie in these islands! Please note that I have used the word "coterie" correctly as it refers to a small group with similar interests who meet frequently.
If 3 out of 10 people who come in contact with gays become gay themselves then can you explain why it is a widely held belief (supported by research findings) that only 10 percent of all people are gay? Surely, the percentage should be higher!
I could not help asking myself if Anita Bryant had moved from Florida to Cayman. Research her history and see if the Lord was on her anti-gay side! 98% of child molesters are gay? What is your source for this figure? You may get such an impression because the press makes a bigger deal out of an incident when it involves the same sex but child molestation and sexual orientation are not related. Child molesters are mentally ill, homosexuals are not!
Linking crime and gayness is ludicrous. The only known link is that crimes against gays are higher in an intolerant society such as ours!
To all of you who would like to follow the Old Testament and stone gays, read it carefully and you may find that even in Cayman there may not be enough stones for all the offenders of the old laws. Let him without sin (Pastor Bob or you, M. Lite?) be the one to cast the first stone!!!!!!!!!!!
anon @ 14:49 That was tongue in cheek humour. There are no "stats".
I usually despise those who post in caps, but WOW!
He was kidding. Here, have a piece of chicken.
Can I catch the gayness through my cpmputer as a virus?
Umm, M. Lite is obviously taking the p!ss…"turn the other cheek", "gay penetration into our society", "wipe this filth away from the faces of caymanian people"…I had a good laugh anyway.
Seriously people, there is a lot more wrong with our society than a few different minded, law abiding visitors…it will be interesting if this crime keeps up to see the day come that these islands are begging for a few gay visitors 😉
I’ll pop your head if I had to cast the 1st big rock!
Great exercise routine – jumping to conclusion… Clearly you are not blessed with a sense of humour. M. Lite is taking the pi$$ out of the situation. I am sure as a Gaymanian you are justifiably defensive as your own fellows are so intolerant, but lighten up – we are on YOUR side!!!
The whole bigoted, attitude of the church on this is unacceptable to any rational and reasonable person in this day and age – just as our parents fought to bring down the barriers of race and slavery.
Sit back, take a chill pill, and laugh a little – at the church – they are the one’s making a$$es out of themselves in a very public forum!!!
As many people noticed… but you did not… M.Lite was using the fine art of satire to make a point…
M.Lite is on your side!
I believe the sarcasm/ satire which the poster used flew way over your head. Re-read the post and you may better understand it.
Why are you hating on child molesters? You are just a bigot by discriminating against them. You need to love them. You are just being negative. They should have special protection in the Constitution.
Love the man, hate the sin. I believe an effort should be made to minister to them rather than turn them further from who God is. We may not like to but doesn’t the Great Commission apply to all? Take your chance at reaching one man and having them come than to not reach any and all turn away.
It is not aChristian’s job to hate against but to be obedient to the Holy Spirit. Not that you should condone the acts but I believe effort should be made to reach a level where they can see God in your lives.
Decency is still to be kept (gay or not) in public and what a man does in private is between him and God and the person(s) involved. But the energy to protest should be transformed into energy to reach. Christ did not come to condemn but to save. Sin has always been sin and our excuses for sinning cannot justify. However, CMA ought to seek to be the visible Christ to the world. Romans 10:9
Mr or Ms Anon
You are trying to preach and are not qualified.
You must be either barren, or have no children. Have you consided the negative demoralizing impact that these gay people will have on our society, especially our children and our youth? if they are allowed to display their sexual preferential behavior in front of our children. I hope they come to your house first to have a stage show there. You are trying to preach tell me again, what could you possibly be teaching your children, about God? yeah right, how about protecting their little spirits hearts, minds and emotions from being destroyed by the impact this could have on them, if they are exposed to this kind of gay display on our shores. You are the most ignorant so called christian I have ever encountered. we all love them we just have enough God in us and sense enough to protect our society from the impact that it can make on our people especially the children and the youth who we are trying to shape into upstanding moral agents to be examples in our society. Tell me are you allowing your children to watch porn? well you don’t seem to have any idea what gay people go on with when they get one inch they take a foot. Our children are confused enough already and you seem to want to finish them off. The kids will believe that if its Ok to land here, then what they do is OK and that the gay lifestyle is ok as well. Well thats not the case here, we hate the gay lifestyle while we love them. Go to Bible school please before you take up preaching, you havn’t a clue what you are talking about, and you have far less a clue the serious consequences this kind of behavior can have on our society and who suffers? our kids. We’ll have to import a boat load of psychiatrists to put their minds back together when these liberals finish their stage shows on our beaches in front of our kids.
Try to be silent on this subject you’re not a contributor to our society, you are just an idiot, hiding behind christianity. I hope your pastor does not have the same perceptions as you do, because if he does, he’s just as lost as you are, and he’s ripping off the church..
By the way, about winning them over to Christ, they have the same opportunity to get to know Christ, as anyone else. The United States preaches the gospel to more nations and far and wide in the whole United states of America, so why arn’t they schanging. Some of them have some lesbians and some gay men have accepted the lord, changed their lives and even have been married in traditionally family style. aman marrying a woman and a woman marrying a man and thats the result of people who want to change. There is a segment that refuse to change. YOu don’t seem to be aware of that. It just so happens that ratner than coming to Christ they spend millions of dollars annually lobbying in Washington and the UK to criple the Church and handicap our pastors in attempt to shut the mouths of Gods Ministers from preaching against homosexuality. How dare you defend these people, you need to read, and I mean read, about what these people do to churches.. They are trying to stop the church of jesus Christ from preaching against sin, and they have the nerve to hire lawyers to pass laws to shut the mouths of our pastors and preachers and teachers. You have really angered me and I am not sparing you at all in this forum .These gays try to force their life style down our throats.Well you go ahead and suck up to them for the almighty dollar, we have our kids to live for, obviously you dont.We do not go all over the world forcing people to accept our way of life, But by golly if and when they come here, they must respect the standards that we uphold.
Unlike some of you all out there, I spotted M. Lite’s comments as satire immediately, but this one….I can’t figure out whether this is the kind of loony he was taking the p*ss out of or a copycat wit. He sure does sound serious, but then…..
"….well you don’t seem to have any idea what gay people go on with when they get one inch they take a foot."
"These gays try to force their life style down our throats. Well you go ahead and suck up to them for the almighty dollar….."
A closet gay fundamentalist egghead or a joker. I don’t know whether to be scared or laugh.
Take his sentence A and add to sentence B and it does sound like he’s looking for a taste of a Subway sandwich, or something along those lines…
John, forget all those other people reading this and listen to me for a minute. I’m serious here. You are gay.
Only a closet gay is that angry about gayness. You will never be happy until you admit that you like men. Your secret is safe with us but I really think you should be courageous and just come out with it. Just say, "I’m gay and proud of it." Until then you are doomed to hate yourself and others and all that anger is messing you up. Trust me, I know what I’m talking about.
We’re praying for you John.
"These gays try to force their life style down our throats. Well you go ahead and suck up to them " Phnaaar, phnaar. John Smith might be in the closet and this is his subconscious plea for a little luvvin’.
May God have mercy on your soul is all I can say and while still on earth may He help you get your head out of your a$$.
I will gladly go to confession just for being able to say that and feel a massive sense of relief for having said it. Luckily my God is a forgiving God! You are painting an unpleasant portrait of your God with your presentation.
No more comments as there is no way you’d hear me or anyone else trying to talk sense into you considering the placement of your head.
To each is own I guess and luckily no matter which of us is right or wrong I do believe we will be forgiven and meet in heaven some day. For your sake though I hope you don’t have a heavenly neighbour who is gay!
I am a parent and I would be rather upset if somebody came to my house and attempted to stage a heterosexual stageshow. Our homosexual friends have come to visit us and would have been rather embarrassed if we had suggested that perhaps they would like to put on a show for us.
The church has been known to be quite flexible in the past in regards to forbidden pastimes. Did you know that the capybara is designated as a fish so that catholics can eat meat during lent? If somebody wants to eat meat, let them eat meat!
I’m not a qualified preacher so that may have come out wrong but you know what I mean. 😉
7Mr "smith",
Your words are truly the words of a nescient man.
You speak of "our children"- I would never want any child of mine to come within any close proximity of a person as evil as yourself.
I feel more obliged to " protect their little spirits hearts, minds and emotions from being destroyed by the impact " of someone as ignorant, hateful and uneducated as yourself.
As for others preaching- I would love to knowwho the pastor you go to is- I will be sure to avoid him planting such seeds of hatred in my loved ones.
I just pray that one day you learn to live in peace and love.
Get back to work Miss Julie, there are far more important things for you to be concerned about.
I am pleased that the Cayman Ministers’ Association is taking this stand against the so-called ‘gay’ people who wish to visit our island for a day and enjoy themselves. With the viscous waveof violent crime sweeping this island I really don’t think there is anything that should concern right-thinking Caymanians more than what these men and women are getting up to in their private lives. Sometimes I sit and imagine what they do and believe me it makes me feel so sick I have to pray just to get the images out of my head.
Time to picket the Lobster Pot and all crustacean-dishing restaurants!!!
Don your frocks, gather the flocks, we are going to right this island, one sin at a time.
** Some conditions apply – picketers must be completely free from sin, have never broken the law, treated all human beings the way they want to be treated, been fair and equitable in all aspects of life and never strayed from the path of the Lord.
Now come on all of you, let’s go… Awww shucks, noone showed…
I could not agree more. Why has the CMA picked on the ‘gays’ and not those who consume shellfish? Or pork? All these things go on in Cayman today and are condemned equally by The Bible. Isn’t the last thing we need a boatload of gays eating shrimps and pork? We do not want our islands to sink beneath the waves, as Sodom and Gomorrah were smited by God, do we? I think we can fill the empty space in Heroes Square by some stocks, and we could lock ‘gays’ and ‘porkeaters’ in them and throw rotten vegetables at them. Or how about, instead of new cruise berths, a ducking stool in George Town harbour. We could put those we thought were ‘gay’ (or just anyone we didn’t like) on the ducking stool and duck them in the sea. If they floated, they would certainly be ‘gay’ and we could then stone them to death legitimately. If they sank, they would be innocent. But dead. Come on McKeeva, can Steve McField be awarded the contract to do it?
I had a pork chop the other day.
It was a small pork chop and I didn’t inhale.
Should I be worried about it?
pastor bob… typically unchristian views from a so called christian minister… ask yourself what would jesus do?
Bob and the rest of cma …get back to your money making scam churches…
The CMA has to realize that this is the new mellnium and should ask themselves "What would Jesus do?" I think that he is a loving and caring God and accepts anyone as they are. Shouldn’t we be that way too.
I say accept the Gay Cruisers here our business is Tourism not banning tourist regardless of thier sexuallity. I ask the Gay crusiers to conduct themselves in a civil and decent manner as a normal hetrosexual couple would do and do not over exert themselves to prove a point.
Relax everyone. These dinosaurs are best viewed as entertainment. Just watch the preachers and their faithfully tithing zombies get all worked up over gays and have a good laugh about it.
I’m sure the gay tourists will be laughing at them if they turn up at the dock to protest with their misspelled words on signs like they did several years ago.
The position of hate and fear that these people cling to is so obviously wrong and pathologicalthat we do a disservice to moral progress by reacting to it in anyway other than to ridicule it.
There is no debate to be had here because one side of this equation is mentally and emotionally retarded. They are incapable of thinking through this issue. They sold their soul to a preacher’s lies and now they are lost.
Face the facts: They read an ancient book that is filled with ridiculous stories and horribly immoral demands–and believe it! They talk to an invisible make-believe being every day, for Pete’s sake! These people need help, they need compassion, not a serious hearing.
I for one hope a few of these nutbags protest in public on the day of the dreaded gay invasion. Cayman can be boring sometimes and that’s great entertainment. It’s like seeing a reenactment of how people lived and thought thousands of years ago before they knew any better.
The greatest tragedy is that at least some of these gay obsessed Caymanians are hating themselves. Is there any doubt that some of them are wearing pink thongs, right this very moment, while listening to a Village People song on their iPod? How sad it must be to feel you have to publicly hate what you are in private.
I hope the gay cruise ship tourists know that not all Caymanians have been mentally deranged by religion. Some of us, maybe even most of us, have love in our hearts for all.
Please don’t judge us by the worst and loudest among us.
Not again…live and let live…who cares what others do in the privacy of their own home or on a cruise with like minded people.
On shore our Public Decency Laws apply so there.
Pastor Bob don’t you have better things to do??? I have seen you at the hospital and you are not the most discreet of people. On that occasion we had an elder relative in hospital and we and the doctors were not telling them that they had had a heart attack until all the air ambulance arrangements could be made. Pastor Bob took it upon himself to walk in the room and announce he was there to visit the heart attack patient. Of course that caused a huge upset to our patient. Not your finest hour then and not your finest hour now.
I am sure there are patients who look forward to your visits and I understand you are truly dedicated.
I am far too busy working my two jobs trying to make ends meet. I like most of Cayman will be at work so I won’t see what goes on at the dock or beach. My sons will be at school as well.
I have friends here who are gay. Unfortunately they are not free to live as openly with their partners as I am to live with my husband. They are good, generous, loving law abiding individuals.
I have explained to my sons that you do not choose who you fall in love with. If you are lucky enough to find that special person enjoy whether it be the same or opposite sex. I would hope every parent is sensible enough to do the same.
I say welcome all to our Island. Just respect us while you are here. We in turn will do the same to you.
"On shore our Public Decency Laws apply so there."
I guess those get waived for Batabano or any other street festival. The simulated sex in the street is exactly the type of behavior the decency law is supposed to deter.
So teenagers dry humping down the street is OK but two gays kissing or holding hands is a horrendeous act not acceptable in public.
Your children should castrate you, then cremate you !. You are one SICK F****K
We’re still praying for you, John. We know you’re fighting with yourself. It’s OK to be gay.
I had to read the post you were responding to a second time before I realized the reason for your outburst. I almost bust a gut laughing when I got this mental picture of you all red in the face and about to burst a vein in your neck. lol.
If we can arrange for some public displays of chidren castrating their mothers that would become a unique tourist attraction. Maybe the first one ever could be performed at the grand opening of Dr. Shetty’s new hospital.
Anyway, it is nice to see such a loving attitude displayed towards a fellow human being from someone who has the love of Christ in them.
The loving voice of modern fundamentalist Christianity.
Do you know what outrages me about the Ministers Association?
Caymanian after Caymanian are murdered on Grand Cayman and you hear nothing from the Ministers Association…nothing.
A gay cruise ship is planning to arrive and the ministers are awaken and suddenly speak out.
Now what is that about?
I am disgusted…
Who are these morons who bring Church into everything? The Church has its place and its purpose and right now its out of line.
Allowing the ‘gay’ cruise ship is not only about a dollar, its about leaving ignorance behind us, where it belongs. Half the so-called Christians who are quoting scriptures have never read the bible.. they only quote what they hear the next man repeat…so please get it right and stop hiding behind the bible to defend your own hatred.
What are you afraid of??? I have from some people that they are worried about ‘catching it’, dont be stupid…the only thing you have caught is ignorance and you need to get rid of it.
Block the ship…go ahead.. do you not think that gay people visit our islands by airplane. Lets see the CMA try to stop all airlines from arriving. While you are at it please go and try to stop births at the hospital because you must be unaware that there are GAY CAYMANIANS.. what you think they caught it from the last gay cruise ship? Well then its only a matter of time before it spreads to you… so go hide under a rock.
Sorry but the commenter that said:
No,
We are doomed if we listen to you!
Thank god for the MInisters Association.
Surely if you are as religious as you claim you should be ashamed of yourself for you callous use of His name – God not god – god is an idol that one may worship God is the one and only and maybe that is where you are confused – there is a big difference between the two and the faith that goes with both.
Hmmm…
We are also doom if we listen to you too, Mr. John Smith. We all need to listen to God, and the Minister’s Association, is not God nor His mouth piece!
Thank God for that!
Some Buddist Questions for CMA (and Cayman at large):
Universalibility principle – "How would I like it if someone did this to me?"
Consequences – Does the act causes harm and regret (in oneself or others) or benefit and joy?
Utilitarian principle – Will the act help or harm the attainment of goals (ultimately spiritual liberation)?
Intention – Is the act motivated by love, generosity and understanding?
Now you stumped them – better soak their little hot heads in some holy water…
There are many Theological doctrines, indeed many Christians (on this island), that would take great exception to Pastor Bob Thompson’s views. He speaks on behalf of the radically conservative and evangelical doctrines of theology that flourish in Middle America and the Caribbean.
Their flocks are not part of modern Christianity, and for example, are far removed from the opinions of the comparatively homophobic Holy See in Rome. Pope Benedict XVI made this statement in 2008:
"It is deplorable that homosexual persons have been and are the object of violent malice in speech or in action. Such treatment deserves condemnation from the Church’s pastors wherever it occurs."
– Pope Benedict XVI
lol…
of all persons, you have to use the Pope as a moral guide. They have killed and turtored more people than World War 1 and 2 combined!
These Church people need to wake up and realize that we are now in different times. If there is anyone to Judge these people let it be our maker. These so call Church people are nothing but hypocrites, what they all need to stop doing is talking gossip about everyone that walks into Church. They also need to stop talking about what numbers played after Church. This is a new generation of change.
"Look into your own life before you Judge anyone."
The CMA. Were these not the same cult leaders they called to input their "DIM" archaic ideas on our Constitution "Demodernization" ?
-Islandboz
What does the motto ‘He hath founded it upon the seas‘ have to do with directing their decision on gay cruises?
If the church wants to do something useful. Why doesn’t it focus it’s energy on educating the families that attend the churches on how to be decent citizens. They should be addressing the teenage pregnancy problems, the gangster culture, the entitlement culture, the racist bigotry, the harbouring of criminals, the bad parenting, the caymanian way of ignoring the importance of education, all those problems which are destroying the island
But instead they ignore all that and focus on a few gay day trippers who want to come here enjoy our island and spend a few bucks.
The goverment can’t cut,chastize, or make responsible civil service because thats ITS PEOPLE!
The church can’t cut, chastize, or make responsible all the bad people on Cayman for the same reason.
Hope this clears it up.
Im sorry but regardless of individual beliefs – Homosexuality is LEGAL in Cayman. So if you don’t like it people – lobby for the the law to be changed – until then – deal with it.
oh and no one has the right to judge others life choices that result in blatant discrimination and victimization.
Caymanians are again showing what a stupid, backwater, petty, small-minded and intolerant community this really is.
Cayman – have a look at the company you’re keeping: American deep south, Saudi Arabia and other intolerant, right-wing areas.
If Jesus was alive today he would be against everything Cayman stands for.
Stop being and idiot. A few narrow minded church representatives do not represent the entire population of the Cayman Islands, so stop making this into a Caymanian issue.
If you just want to post something to put down Cayman or Caymanians, please do so in context and not and in a somewhat intelligent way. Otherwise, you are just blindly lashing out for the sake of what?
It’s real easy to jump on a forum and click thumbs up or thumbs down, but the reality of this situation is that everyone has been given a free will and based on our opinions, we will make our choice.
Our opinions may be based on truth, feeling, someone else’s opinion or personal agenda and we are free to spout as we please.
Even if we claim to be speaking the truth and we do it in a hateful way, we are equally to blame.
Unless you have personally experienced the afterlife and come back to enlighten us, your opinion is just that, an opinion.
Each one is accountable for their own actions, their own words and on the day of accountability, God will not be swayed by mob rule, so you may click a thousand thumbs down, it does not matter.
You may even exercise your free will to ignore God completely, it matters not. (except to you)
You may exercise your free will to say that God is hateful because He does not condone us doing as we please? The world is full of parents who have let their kids run loose and look where we are now.
It matters not, because none of us have the last say, no not even you sir or you ma’am.
Not one of us really speaks for anyone else, gays, straight or otherwise. We speak for ourselves. I would simply recommend that each one of us do the best we can to honour our Creator because he has given us so much and we have thrown His grace back in His face.
Let’s not stand before Him and say, "Well I didn’t know." Somehow, I don’t think that is going to cut it. In closing I would just like to add that if God was willing to give us His only son, then I am pretty sure that He would have a heart big enough to help us get through this life safe and sound.
I am not affiliated with any religious organisation, in fact I hate organized religion because I have personally witnessed the utter destruction it has wrought upon us and mixed with money, it must be responsible for pretty much most of the blood shed on this planet.
When God comes, He won’t find me in church, but He will find me in Christ.
To the churches, I would say that there is so much that needs to be corrected within the walls before you start imposing your views on others.
In the hand of compassion that is moved by the Spirit is the proof of the God who is there. Do something nice for someone today and don’t tell anyone.
Let the gays come and pray for them and be kind to them.
That is the best response I have read.
I believe God exists, and once we believe that over the bible or the church, we are free from everything else that would cause us to pass judgment on others without giving it a second thought. I believe there is a God, but not necessarily in all of what is written in the bible, (and that does not make me an unbeliever, or a non-christian). Who says in the manipulation of the ‘written word’ over the decades by the Catholics it’s not warped, or misinterpreted? And who says it is all the inspired word of our Maker? Who has the proof? If God spoke to them in times past, why can’t he speak to modern-day men in like manner, and in accordance with our times? I think these bible slappers do not have a brain to think for themselves as they are just so lead by organized religion, and fail to realize that God expects us to grow in wisdom, because He has blessed us just like he did those who are alleged to have written the scriptures under His influence. The scriptures is only a guide for humanity and should not be taken literally word for word. We need to pick sense out of non-sense. It’s no wonder intelligent people find it difficult to see Christianity as making sense, because church people are so dwarfed in their thinking that they cannot think outside the box! They are followers, not leaders. Do you see any Jonah and the whale happening? Where is Balaam and the talking donkey? Where is Moses andhis rod and parting the sea? Is all of this really relevant? I’d love to accept over this what Jesus taught before he left this world – that we love one another! (and this should be regardless of our differences) – whatever the differences may be!
Jugement is God’s. No pastor has been appointed over God to act on his behalf when they themselves are born in sin and shapen in iniquity and their righteousness is like filthy rags before Him. No mini-God has been appointed to determine where my soul rests!
If God is who we claim He is and they speak so boldly and in accordance with the scriptures; He is guilty of creating homosexuals, for he created sin! believe it or not! It appears that someone is afraid to approach God and dare ask why! Looks like this God who is author of this world is in trouble! for he created everything – even Satan and choice!
Thank you for an intelligent response!
How do earth do you get "He hath founded it upon the seas" to mean "No gays here"? Somebody explain please!
I think "founded it" can also be translated from ancient Hebrew as "sodomy" and therefore it can be read as implying this kind of thing is best done on cruise ships.
"He hath pounded it on the seas"
And God did make a cruise ship out of Sodom and Gomorrah. It contracted a Big Hole in it and SANK RIGHT DOWN TO THE BOTTOM OF THE SEA !!!
The ship named "Sodom&Gomorrah"
And That’s God’s version of Sodomy.
…or was that Atlantis? And if God really were into smiting cities filled with homosexuals, why isn’t San Francisco at the bottom of the Ocean and why does Fire Island still sit above water? Something doesn’t add up here…
So extramaritial affairs are okay to the churches? Are they going to forbid the offenders from coming into their churches? walking their streets? letting their children go to their homes where their friends live???? I don’t think so
These church leaders are more interested in their agenda than the bible.
While people can argue as to whether being gay is a sin (even if it is, who should cast the first stone?), we can all agree that the recent crime wave is a much bigger problem for the Christians and non-Christians on the island.
I wish these church leaders would tackle real issues like murder and gun crime rather than worry about gay cruise ships.
"First they came for the communists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a communist; Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a trade unionist; Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—because I was not a Jew; Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak out."
Poem attributed to Pastor Martin Niemöller (1892–1984) about the inactivity of German intellectuals following the Nazi rise to power and the purging of their chosen targets, group after group.
When Pastor Bob shows em the firmament then I will listen to him on homsexuality. How is that for a deal?
Jesus never married, hung around with men and lived an alternative lifestyle. Makes you think . . .
Jesus never hung out with other men? His lifestyle wasn’t alterntive? Have you read the BIBLE? just asking.
I think you misread the comment. It meant he didn’t masrry but he did hang out with other men and did live an alternative lifestyle. To all the gay bashers etc.(I am not gau) but try to live my life according to JUDGE NOT LEST YOU BE JUDGED. As far as I believe, when Judgment Day comes we all have to answer for our sins.
Its really agravating to see how our society here in the Cayman Islands that has always upheld Godly principles and great respect for traditional family values; that we are now being challenged in a debate and our local church is being questioned. This is a clear indication of the decline of a society of moral principles being infiltrated by those that have no moral principles and ideas to the degree that now an argument or debate on homosexuality is taking place.
The sin of homosexuality has already been signed sealed and delivered as abominable and unacceptable in God’s site. God is the supreme being that set the standard. God created the family by forming a man namede adam and God gave adam a wife named Eve to be by his side. He told them to be fruitful and multiply, and replenish the earth. There is nothing fruitful or replenishing aboaut a homozexual relationship, it stinks, and it sucks.
God made Adam and Eve, Not adam and Steve, what part of that do you not understand. Read the book of Genesis.
Any family that has two heads is a freak! I mean 2 men or 2 women!
Abnormal!
And yet you lie with the same each noght, blissful in your hypocracy…
Go John John – or is it Jack Meoph?
That’s what they were saying – that he never married, but rather, hung out with men and lived an alternate lifestyle. It is the way you read it, I guess – not clear, but that is what I got.
You have to read the above comment properly & grammatically:
i.e.: When it says Jesus never married (comma), then the ‘never’ part is inferred in front of the "hung out with men’ part and in front of the ‘alternative lifestyle" part. Here you are arguing with someone who says the same thing as you are trying to say!!
Where are they calling for moral deliverance for the murderers and robbers that roam the island? Last I checked they are violating 2 of their fundamental commandments…
And do they think they and their flock is untainted just because they lie down with a woman? In many cases that same woman is actualy married to, or in a relationship with another man!! That’s right, there goes another commandment…
If they want to go out casting hate on others, they should first clean up their own house – gay priests and all!!!
I am glad to see that the ministers association is sticking to their position. We cannot continue to let these “gays” come into our country and indoctrinate our young people! Recent statistics show that for every 10 people that come into contact with a gay, 3 of them catch “the gay”.
This should be the #1 priority for the CMA. People criticize the CMA for not speaking out about the recent spat of deadly crimes around the island or not pushing for harsher sentences for rapist and child molestesr. Well those people are clueless! All of these vile crimes stem from gaydom and the ministers know this. They are going after the root of Cayman’s problems, attacking it at the base and then moving up to the head of the issue. It has been know for many years that 98% of child molesters are gays; 81% of rapist are gays that cannot come to grip with their gaydom and take out their frustration on women. The recent gang style murders have all stemmed from the infiltration of the gays into traditional caymanian coterie. These groups of young men use to assemble to exchange ideas, tell stories of the past and mentor younger boys. Now they are dealing drugs and killing, all thanks to the gays!
It is time that we stop turning the other cheek. We need to attack this problem head on! We will no longer “grin and bare it” when these types of things are thrust upon us! We will no longer stand for this gay penetration into our society!
The CMA has taken it onto themselves to wipe this filth away from the faces of caymanian people. They have the guts to stand up and speak of what’s really wrong with our island. Remember, Jesus might have said “Let him who is without sin cast the first stone”, however Leviticus 20:13 says "If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death. Their blood shall be upon them." Thankfully we know which verse the CMA is following.
Please tell me this post is a joke
Mmmmm……..Perhaps there’s a clue in the author’s name………
Fantastic, satire at its best. Best comment i’ve read in a long time.
Thank you. I crack myself up! Think thats funny? Read the one below.
Damn! Was that satire? I thought it was true.
You forgot that 96% of gun crime is caused by GAYS. 52% unmarried births are caused by GAYS, 88% of bad parents are really GAYS,55% of the Goverment are closet GAYS (which explains a lot) 80% of the turtles at the turtle farm are Gay (wich explains the low birth rates) 89% of the prison population are GAYS which explains why they are there in the first place, EVERYONE in a cayman gang are of course GAY( why else would they hang out with each other no girls aloud and hate everyone else?) And of course your Dad, which is why you turned out the way you have. Its not your fault! And because you had to hang out with your Dad……..Don’t fight it. But you might think about leaving Caman.
You forget that 103% of expats are gay too.
Love to know where you got your stat’s from. Total uneducated ranting nonsense.
Did none of you above posters recognize satire???
It was GLARINGLY OBVIOUS that this was a pi$$ take post…
C’mon…lighten up…
opp’s I will consider myself told off !
You stupid misguided, uneducated nobrot. It was satirical you eejit
Liek me saying that 100% of people like you are a waste of space…oh but hang on, thats true.
You have got to be kidding….where in the H**L did you get statistics that 1 out of every 3 people that come in contact with a gay person will become gay….that is rediculous. The rest of your statistics are crap too!
Try to practice some tolerance you hypocrit!
Um, satire, humor, taking the pi$$ – any of that ring a bell?
That poster is obviously writing a "tongue-in-cheek" commentary poking fun at the intolerant, ignorant people who hate gay people. I found it quite humourous.
Um, satire, humor, taking the pi$$ – any of that ring a bell?
Are you that frigginstupid that you can’t see the humour in this comment?
What a poor, retarded imbecile you are
Too funny…great sense of humour…totally tongue in cheek…excellent.
I myself fell victim to the teachings that were forced upon me during the last visit of this despicablecruise. I was teleported on board their ship as I slept and probed repeatedly. A chip was implanted in an undisclosed location on my body which now issues commands for me to reach out to the youth of these Islands in an effort to convince them to also turn to the brown side. I still go to church but only to seek new prey. I do not like what I have to do but have no control over my own mind as a result of their forced indoctrination.
I am with you Brother Lite, they must be stopped, at all costs before others are taken down the dirty path I have been
Brilliant LOL ! only down side, there are some people out there that will believe you.
Who copied the text of this week’s sermon?
The only thing Gay people on vacation threaten is another persons point of view. Nothing else. The reason it is such a BIG deal is the fear of Haveing THEIR point of view changed period. The only power a church has over anyone (not God, just the church) is the accepting of THEIR point of view over anothers. Their point of view is that GOD HATES gay people. If gay people are seen enjoying their lives and prospering than either God really loves all people and the church has been spreading lies or God hates gay people but hates everyone else equally. Or The God wants us to listen to the Church and hate the Gay people for him.
I do belive in God because of what I have seen in MY life and not because of what anyone told me. I belive he is looking down at us and seeing some people here thinking "because a cruise ship of Gay people coming to our shores is not what we want nor is it good for us and our childen." And at the same time the same people do condone gun crime, murder, rape, incest,babies with no parents,sloth,greed, etc.,etc.,etc.,on their island because it comes from Their people. And they worship a corrupt,greedy,and incompetent leader.
I hope the Gay people who come here on vacation or otherwise will not see the hate and fear and be safe from being harmed by the Caymanian church groups.
150 years ago: Abolition of slavery
100 years ago: The emancipation of women
50 years ago: Interracial marriage
Today: Same sex relationships
Why does the Church always have to be dragged kicking and screaming (by secular outrage) towards the tolerance and compassion that, ironically, it claims to hold a monopoly on?
FEAR!
You know after i read articles like this I get really angry!!
The CMA will make a big stance and protest against a gay cruise ship berthing in the Cayman islands, therefore they are imposing and impling that the entire island and all its inhabitants must be Chrisitian. Yet when Prayer and religion was removed from schools, I do not remeber hearing anything about prostests or letters sent to any government/ Governor/ Premier.
So is the CMA really concerned about the ‘moral rights’ of these islands, or are they just being hateful people who use God as an excuse.
I am a Christian and I KNOW that the Bible states:
Judge Not, Lest Ye be Judged!
I also know many Gay people and I have yet to meet one that imposes their beliefs onto me and attempts to convert to the other side (or whatever you want to say).
Stop interperting the Bible to fit your own vendictive agenda. Stop imposing your hate, and negative beliefs on others!!
Life is short and unfair enough, live, love and enjoy the things that we have now and stop finding things in life to make you angry and hateful.
There they are, I’ve been looking everywhere for the CMA. Not a peep out of them about the social ills and societal disintegration going on around them daily. But the minute a few gays want to stop by and spend a few dollars before heading off on their ever so merry way, here they come in full force, bibles in hand, readyto bash whoever gets in their way.
Typical
"He hath founded it upon the seas"… there I was thinking that motto could not only equally apply to Christopher Columbus as it could God… but what kind of open mouthed "pez despenser" statement is that?! That’s like asking how McKeeva is gonna tighten up fiscal policy on these islands and his response being "2 plus 2 buckle my shoe"!
It goes without saying that why anyone (especially the Government) listens to the Ministers Association is a mystery… Simply because these bigots stand on a pulpit every Sunday and incite hatred against their fellow men and are then given a voice in democratic society (and the simple minded follow their every decree) that they should now somehow have a voice that carry’s weight in local politics… WHY?! Because they say they have the backing of God… I’m pretty sure Al Qaida and the Taleban say much the same thing…
Where are all the protestors? Come on, people! You’re moving slow on this one.
Gays are rapidly taking over everything to do with human lives. Right now we have an openly Gay Minister of the UK Government making decisions that affect our livelyhood, therefore while I commend Pastor Thompson on his stand on this matter, it is just a matter of time before someone in his own organisation takes over and changes the position of the CMA.
Believe it or not Pastor Thompson you represent the drowning man reaching for the straw.
The gays shall inherit the earth
Peek-A-Boo, I see you Monkey
What a load of Tosh!!
Correct me if I am wrong, but are you saying that because a person is gay he is some sort of sub-human who has no right to hold down a job and that the decisions he makes are different/wrong than a "straight" person?
I feel as though I have stepped back in time, as this attitude reminds me of the bigotry and hatred which went on 30 – 40 years ago.
In case you haven’t noticed, we now live in the 21st Century and have moved on from these flimsy arguments, if you and your kind put as much effort into dealing with the more important issues in life, I am sure the world wouldn’t be so full of hate as it is now.
He doesn’t he represents a bigot.
Pastors should keep their noses out of everyones business. There is no place for them in modern society and certainly not in government decision making.
Yo preacher man, Ted Haggard called. He said he wants his hypocrisy back.
Seriously, get a life. With all the crap gay people take every day from people like these prehistoric preachers, they deserve a fun week on a cruise ship. They are on vacation. Can’t you take a vacation from your hating?
I’m not sure what your fantasy faith teaches you but why not give this new radical philosophy a chance: Live your life as a kind person who does as little harm as possible and loves others without fear or prejudice.
Yes, your bronze-age book of myths may tell you that an invisible sky god will kill you if you treat gays as equal human beings, eat lobsters, or buy a roll of toilet paper on the Sabbath, but be bold! Check your watch! We live in a new era.
I know, I know, your hate, fears, and bigotry have no expiration date. Still, you can always just walk away from that evil nonsense. Grow up and live in the modern world. Those chains around your mind and heart are only make believe. All you have to do is decide to break free.
These Cayman preachers and all the other Taliban types need to either switch on your brains and start being decent people or go live in a commune somewhere. How about if the rest of the world gives all you fundie Christians, Muslims and Jews the Sahara Desert? We will wall it off and it’s yours. You have to stay there, though; no visas to come back and visit grown-up world. Would that be acceptable? Then you and all the other faith-based haters can spend your days and nights jabbering at the sky, killing eachother, and scoffing at the concpets of human rights, tolerance and fairness.
I’ll help you pack.
Ps. Love feels so much better than hate. Try it sometime.
I’m not gay…
But what scares me about these Religious people, is them wanting to legislate and impose religious laws on ALL Caymanians, claiming that we are a "Christian Nation" so everyone must comply!
They do not want to see the rights of everyone respected… and that is scary! This is the same issue that overshadows the Afghan people and the manipulative Taliban
Ah, it’s that time again, when the bigots put their idiocy on display for all to see. As Corporal Jones would say, they don’t like it up ’em.
So what is the Premiere’s response to the ministers association and the people of the Cayman Islands that are concerned about their moral standards being threatened by these tourists. Is the premiere and deputy premiere both christians ( the deputy premiere being a very devout Christian) let’s see, just how saved they both are.Are they going to look the other way away from the people’s wishes, just like they’re looking the other way with the work permit issues, continuing to oppress the people falling victim to governments that worship the filthy and almighty dollar.
After all Sister Julie just announced in her new year speech how much she cares about the people of the Cayman Islands and that she want the best for them. Well sister Julie pull out your Bible and read about Sodom and Gomorrah, because a cruise ship of Gay people coming to our shores is not what we want nor is it good for us and our children.We do not condone such alternate or gay lifestyles. Keep that ship out of here.
Stop saying "we"… since when do you speak for others… you may feel free to speak for the 20 other bigots in your bible reading class who miss-interprets the bible every week… but stop trying to speak for free minded society who do not share your idiotic, ancient ideals!
My dear people, why do we keep calling Christian beliefs ancient ideals??
As far as i know modern day society is built off of these same ideals! Check yourself man. Is not the Christian perspective a part of this society and modern day society? In that case are Christians not free to hold onto their ideals as well? In this "free minded society"?
And here I was made to believe that following the word of "God" was all about loving each other….. oh wait no I guess we wouldn’t have all the relidiculous (religious+ridiculous… get it?!) wars being fought, if that was so….. oh hold on, I get it, it is of course because the others believe in the wrong thing and therefore are wrong and should be put down.
Can someone protect me from nutters like this?
Some of these freaks are just like the extremist muslims that become terrorists because they get brainwashed by misreading the Koran.
Get a grip losers. Stop using gods name to suit your narrow minded causes. It’s disgusting when scumbags spout hatred and then claim it is the word of the bible. It’s not, they just twistevery word to suit themselves.
It doesn’t stop them living their own lives in sin. Thats why adultery, teen pregnancies, crime and corruption are all rife in these bible bashing circles but all get swept under the carpet in Cayman.
But all the gun slinging, gang murderers,rapist,wife abusers, corrupted, greedy Caymanians are O.K. with the premier and Sister Julie because the bible doesn’t say anything about them right? You condone this right? The peacefull, happy, and successfull Gay people have a lot more to fear from Cayman then Cayman does from them. Because of you.
Are you kidding me? It would be a dam slap in everyones face if the gov actually would do anything about this because of the church. They have ignored the entire population over the last few months when everyobdy was crying out about the spike in crime and unemployment and not one thing has been done about it. How high on the priority list do you think the gay cruiseship issue is with all other crap happening around here????
There is a reason why there needs to be a division of church and government!