Churches get $4M public cash
(CNS): The country’s premier gave a little more insight this week into how the $7 million allocated to his ministry’s Nation Building Programme in the first two financial years had been spent when he revealed that more than half had gone to 19 different churches. McKeeva Bush had been pressed during Finance Committee in June to explain how the money was being spent as legislators were asked to vote for more than $3 million for the 2011/12. At the time the premier was reluctant to spell out exactly what the money was being used for. On Wednesday Bush said $4.1 milllion had been spent on churches and the rest on various community projects and scholarships for 20 students.
The fund had raised controversy because of the lack of clarity on where the money was going or how it was allocated and the opposition leader had pointed out in Finance Committee that funds of this kind are normally allocated through ownership agreements and properly accounted for.
Speaking in the Legislative Assembly this week, the premier told his parliamentary colleagues that the bulk of the money had gone to churches to help them upgrade their buildings to be hurricane shelters or use for after school programmes and other community outreach.
He said it was good value for money in assisting churches to enhance their shelter capability from a public safety perspective but he said there were other reasons as well for helping them.
“Perhaps the fundamental justification for supporting the churches, however, may be more readily grasped if we ask ourselves this: what would our society have been like; what, in today’s pressured realities would it be like, were it not for our churches? Where else would we get the enduring ethical guidance that our churches continue to urge upon us?” he asked.
He added that the $4.1 million to about 19 churches from West Bay to Cayman Brac had allowed them to complete and extend facilities, to augment outreach work and services, such as after-school programmes, as well as build new hurricane shelters. However, the premier did not say which churches had received public cash or how much had been given to each one.
He urged his colleagues to consider beyond the “short-term gains they may make by seeking to heap calumny on our Nation-Building efforts,” and he suggested that the opposition was “seeking to tear it down through speculation and innuendo” the national building programme.
“I urge them to be mindful of where we have come from and where we might end up if we’re not careful,” he warned as he spoke about the important role he believed church played in people’s lives.
He also said the nation building programme was about helping young people who may have made mistakes in the past and had not acquired the necessary qualifications or didn’t fit the criteria to get scholarships through normal routs, as he pointed out that 20 young people were being helped on a variety of educational and training paths in subjects ranging from music to political science.
“The large majority of well-meaning people will appreciate that there is a necessity for us to have a Young Nation-Builders Programme; they will consider that the $380,000 we spent on scholarships issued under this programme, up to the end of June, is money well spent,” he said. “I have previously indicated that the scholarships awarded under this programme require a new form of commitment from the recipients. They undertake to invest in development of their leadership abilities and skills, and to work in the community for the cause of nation-building.”
Aside from churches and students, Bush also listed a number of other projects and programmes that he said the fund had been used for which came under the moniker of 'nation building'.
He said $10,000 was given to the Under 19 Girls Football Team, $35,000 to the North Side District Council, $65,000 for hurricane shutters for 13 elderly and needy Caymanians, $75,000 for the Cayman National Cultural Foundation, $25,000 sponsorship for cat-boat building and racing, $55,000 had gone to refurbish “a well-known private museum”, which was not named, and $60,000 for a programme to nurture musical and performance talent. He also revealed that $750,000 had gone to the Pines Retirement Home.
In a different vein, the premier said he had paid the contractors who were out of pocket when Matrix defaulted on its government contract to remove scrap metal from the island to the tune of $365,000, and a long standing planning appeals tribunal case had been settled with a grant of $17,000.
The premier said he was proud to be associated with the work of the nation building programme andhe hoped that soon people will begin to see those helped by it begin to be visible in the community as an active force for good.
“There is no credible way to deny the reality that as leaders it is our duty to put in place the ways and means to nurture the values and the skills as well as to build the institutions that are needed to create a strong nation. This is how we must prove our stewardship,” Bush told the House.
Category: Politics
Bush is disconnected from the people of Cayman and needs to be disconnected from their money
MY JESUS IS NOT DEAD but you readers get off track so easily. The topic is not about GODS and RELIGIONS. Get back to the point. 4 Mil. given to churches when Caymanians salaries are cut, unemployment is high, electricity and water bills are being disconnected from the homes that have single mothers.
(A) Children graduating with a fraction of education. These very kids wake up and have no JOBS, no HOPE, no lives. A lot of them are HUNGRY,
(B) They see their parents crying because they are no monies to feed them or reconnect the basics, that is CUC, Water and FOOD. So they plan a robbery, they find the guns and they KEEP THEM.
(C) Give these children an opportunity. THEY all need help. Hire genuine Locals to seek out these homes which I have described and assist them. They exist right here and they need help.
(D) I am a Christian and I contribute my sum to the plate every Sunday, but I also assist the poor with more. Just that, I cannot do it alone. The Church which I love dearly assist others overseas with their missionary work, but I believe we could start some missionary work right here.
(E) Get these young people equipped so that they can turn in their guns and do not feel rejected in their own island.
(F) By the way, I am not a Caymanian only a paper one from the caribbean , but I do see the NEED for these people that I love so dearly and my heart ache for them.
(G) Please start building Factories and Trade Schools, become innovative and employ these women to make things in the factories and export stuff, just do something. I find myself crying while ending this memo it really hurts what is happening to the POOR Caymanians. My Jesus is not dead and He knows that the Churches can take care of themselves.
Thank you very much for your post, your dead on with all these prob;lems in our country, again thank you…
What a Waste. Mac needs to go.
4million could be spent on…
1) The education system
2) less fortunate
3) Developing Sports
4) Buling a school of Trade (technical school)
5) Improving ucci ( standard, on par with Uk/canada/Us college)
6) crime prevention/awareness (rehabilitation)
7)Health Care
8) Pines
but churches- u got to be kidding me – Jesus nor desciples had ac, or nice parking lots etccc…
Since this is the road we have started down I dare ask what about other the religions?
We know that there are nationals from over 100 countries in our beloved Cayman Islands and our policy has been to welcome them. Many are not Christian. We have Hindus, Muslims, Jews, Buddhists etc that have been here for many years. The majority of these individuals have caused no problems for our diverse community. In fact, the Premier's recently proposed plans for the Shetty hospital and Chinese port projects will increase the number of non-Christians in our community.
So, I ask, shouldn't "nation building" include everyone in the "nation"? Was any funding offered to followers of other religions by the Premier? Could the Premier's actions then be argued as a violation of human rights based on the blatent preferential treatment shown to followers of Christianity?
Once again, we have another example of an action taken by the Premier that has not been properly thought through.
Here's food for thought, I wonder how would Caymanians would feel about their tax proceeds paying for the construction of a Hindu temple or an Islamic mosque?
– Just another day in Absurdistan –
Hindus, Muslims, Jews and Buddhists do not form a significant part of our population nor is there any record of charitable endeavours performed by them and so they really do not belong in this discussion. Because of their relatively small numbers there has been no opportunity for problems to arise. On the other hand, many churches have a long and distinguished history of public service, community outreach and charitable endeavours.
But all of this misses the point. A hurricane shelter will serve all and sundry regardless of religious belief or the absence thereof.
So just because they do not form a significant part of our community there-fore we should discriminate against them.You Sir, Madam are one of those people Jesus spoke of in his teachings. "A Pharisee".
DEFINITION:
1. Having pretensions to superior sanctity.
2. A self-righteous person; A hypocrite.
One of the greatest attributes we should all try to acquire is "Humility" be humble!
Wasn't it Jesus himself who said ! Where two or three are gathered in my name that he would be there. Love your neighbor as you love yourself. He loves us all Hindus, Muslims, and Buddhists. Wasn't Jesus a jew?
Your post is ridiculous. No issue of discrimination arises (a) because there is no significant representation of these religions so they are not in the same position and they have not done any services to the community; and (b) because the shelter will be open to people of these religions. The issue has nothing to do with any supposed lack of humility or supposed lack of love on my part. You had no basis for such statements. Most baffling of all was your purpose in providing this quote: "Wasn't it Jesus himself who said ! Where two or three are gathered in my name that he would be there". What on earth has this got to do with the issue?
Apart from the discrimination point, a hurricane shelter outside the ambit of the control of government inspection procedure, which in fact may not be called upon for several years, may prove to have become, when it is called upon to be used for that purpose, less than adequate. If a building is to be used for public shelter it should be built by a public authority or, if not, be subject to regular public inspection to ensure its contiuned vialbility. Once built to keep a building up to the required safety standards there will be on-going maintenance and possible further improvements required….who is going to fund the inspection and maintenance, on-going ,of a series of buildings throughout the Islands to ensure they meet the required standard?Are there sufficient members of the relevant qualified staff available to cope with inspecting several private as well as the alreday provided public shelters? AND when making your choiice of shelter how will you know the shelter you choose has been subject to saftey checks etc? That goes for any publicly funded program including after school care etc. If the gov has been instumental in funding such programs, by providing money for buildings etc, if there is a problem later down the road and someone is injured, it might be that the injured person or their estate, if dead, comes after government rather than the "owner" of the building….
A recognised hurricane shelter is by definition not outside the control of govt. inspection. Your whole post is misconceived. The truth is if govt. built a shelter on its own (1) it would cost govt. a great deal more to build (2) govt. would be responsible for all maintenance costs; and (3) it would be a complete waste as it would be underused. Your arguments are bogus.
But my point is WILL these be “recognised” shelters? Or will they just be built as if hurricane shelters. Just because an organisation claims it is….how will we know?
what??!!! hello you missing the point! majority of this "nation" is NOT hindu, islamic or even Jewish.
The issue being discused is: why gov has to give churches money? and will these churches show enough transperency as to the usage and how much of these funds will benefit the community (if any) and how much (if any) will go to pastors. MORAL ETHICS!
so don't come with an argument for freedom to pegan gods, this is not the forum!!
You have missed the point entirely of the posting to which you have replied. Why because of your bigotry! The worhipers of the Jewish Faith and the Moslem faith worship the SAME God as those of the Christian faith…."when you know nothing of a subject shout your bigotry loud in confident ignorance"
We worship the same God as the Jews – Yahweh. The Muslim god, Allah, is the pagan moon god. Before Islam was introduced the pagan Arabs worshipped the moon god by praying towards Mecca several times a day. Muslims today pray towards Mecca several times a day. The pagan Arabs worshipped the moon god by making a pilgrimage to Mecca, walking around the Kaba, and kissing the black stone. Muslims today do all these things. The pagan Arabs sacrificed animals to the moon god. Muslims today sacrifice goats to Allah during a celebration called Eid-ul-Adha. Pagan Arabs threw stones at figures representing the devil. Muslims today do the same. Muslims today fast during Ramadan which is the month that begins and ends with a crescent moon.This explains why the crescent moon is the symbol of Islam. It is placed on top of mosques etc. it is a symbol of the moon god.
Yes, very interesting. So where does God Incarnate in the form of Jesus come into the picture?
He doesn't. Allah has no son according to the Koran.
Pardon me, but is this the same God who presented His Son as His Incarnate Being? Kindly clarify so that we can fully understand your statement.
With such trying economic times it seems the existing Government is more concerned about feeding their faith rather than there very own children. In the recent 2011-2012 budget (June 22, 2011 Caymanian Compass "Budget reduces funds for some social programmes") the Government announced that school lunches provided by Children and Family Services will be reduced from as many as 900 per day to 650 per day. When September rolls around will your child be one of the 350 who won't eat at school today?
$4,000,000 could provide every single student in the Cayman Islands Government School board a nutritionally balanced hot meal for lunch every day at school for the entire school year. But better I suppose a church get it's roof fixed.
I agree but schoolchildren can't vote so………………….
That's an even bigger waste of money. Your nice hot nutritional meal would have been scraped into the garbage by the MAJORITY of students in the public schools. Current Minister was almost 'eaten' for lunch by parents protesting why the school doesn't give their children things they like instead of these old bad tasting 'health food'.
So no need to waste money on that exploit as you suggest
i hope they take every cent and dont vote for him nor the others of is govt!!
People, in reply to the message by 'God help us' I can only say that I am only thinking about what's best for the children. Of course the congregation will also benefit from any assistance, but unity and togetherness is what Wesleyan Church is all about!
Ask anyone.
Thank you
I'm sure that the Principal and teachers (and students & parents) who attended the last school year would all agree on this "togetherness"… Yeah right!!
The good men of West Bay seem to have lost their backbones!
i firmly believe that ALL piblic monies under the control of ANY government of the Cayman Islands MUST be properly accounted for, by way of an appropriate receipt for services rendered. If this does not occur and monies cannot be accounted for, then the controling government should be held accountable and investigated under the statutory regulations of the Proceeds of Crime Law, Money Laundering Reguations and the Anti-Corruption Law.
In my opinon, what this government has done in the giving away public funds without having received a legitimate and resonable service is indeed a crime and misuse of public funds.
And I firmly believe that ANYONE in government in the Cayman islands would just laugh at your beliefs.
I'm confused, I thought Jesus answered all prayers spoken in his name. Why does a church have to be fortified against hurricanes? Why does it take millions of dollars to keep kids out of trouble after school?
Sounds like somebody's lackin' some faith in the churches to me. Come on, preachers. You say to pray on it and have faith that the Lord will reward us later when it's a matter of people giving you their hard-earned cash. But when it comes to hurricanes and social programs, you don't care so much about prayersand faith, you want that cold cash.
Maybe you guys are less deluded than we thought. Seems like you know what's real and what's not when it comes to your wallets.
Carrying on like this with the people's money, I imagine you must be worried, assuming you actually believe in that place called hell you are always scaring gullible people with.
Your initial clause, with the greatest of respect, goes some way to explain your bewilderment. If I ask Jesus in prayer for $1,000,000 for an idea – however much it would seem (to me) to be in accordance with His Will – does it mean He is duty bound to provide it? God (Jesus) rightly fully expects us to apply our divinely provided intelligence to understand what He has said to us. When we ask for something and don't receive it, well that's our answer. It's His Will that's at the core of things when all said and done.
I always thought it quite strange that the preachers and politicians have not been speaking out against the crime wave that has overtaken this country. Now we know why.
Yours in despair……….
Matthew 6:24 Nuff said!!!
i wonder if heaven takes personal checks? because the church sure does.
hopefully my check doesn't bounce for no sufficient funds, i forgot let me post date it until i find a JOB!!!
I have a few ideas for these churches taht took my 3.2% paycut. First of all, I'm having problems paying my light bill, food and gas so you can provide a soup kitchen, free gas and we can all come stay in the church and soak up your a.c.
Please dont assume that the WB SDA church is using the SJACPS hall for free!!! I'm sure that information is readily available at either the school of the Department of Education. While your are getting the information, find out how much is paid when the hall is used for parties, receptions etc. Be sure to post your findings so we can all know.
I asked and the answer was that nothing is paid. I don't have anything against WB SDA but I don't believe that any outside organisation should get to use any school facilities and run the a/c for free every week. If it was being used for a government after school programme or anything like that it would be different. We all should not be paying taxes to run the a/c and give the space rent free, especially nowadays when Govt is struggling to make money. Apparently, this is the case for all the school halls. The private school halls can be rented so why doesn't government use this as a source of revenue?
I wish all information was so readily available!!! I know for a fact that the WB SDA pays each and every month for the 4 hours a week that the hall is used. Dont know how you got the information so early on a Monday morning though. But check again please.
I feel bad for the Christian civil servants who lost their jobs so that Mr. Bush could pay off their pastors.
This is an outright disgrace! The Ministers Association must come clean and inform the Caymanian people what they have spent our hard earned money on and how our society will benefit.
Every NGO who gets a grant from the Government has to account to the Government and the people (read the 2011/12 Budget document on the Government website) and these churches must be required to do the same. As a matter of fact, many of these worthy charities such as the National Gallery and the National Trust have had their funding cut in the past two budget cycles.
So come on good Christian leaders, since we cannot rely on our Government for good accounting, the very least you all could do is speak up on something important for once. Call a press conference and tell us each Church that has received some of this funding and what it has been used for so.
Most have had their grant budgets cut in that time period.
This is so wrong! Any Ethical minded person will find this highly questionable.
But, will anything be done by the "Powers and Shakers"? Not very likely!
The "As long as i get mine" mentality is alive and kickin, in our Cayman Islands.
TRADE SCHOOL is what he should have used some of that money to set up. What compassion does he have for these young people? I am disappointed with this movement Mr. Mac. Get some trade schools started for these young people. Can the churches reimburse you some of these monies for a real CAUSE?
4 million could have modernized UCCI on par with US colleges instead of the small band-aids that are keeping the delapidated buildings together now . I guess we know where Cayman's true priorities lay…definitely not in its own future here on Earth…just some imaginary gold plated streets in the sky…
HELP! HELP! Who can we trust? One spends it on the schools and the other one on the churches. Such a shame when 95% of the island who are islanders cannot find enough to spend on groceries or electricity bills. But, who is prepared to rescue us?
It's no wonder these Preachers are not saying anything. It's paid silence. The slience of the paid Lambs. What a disgrace. The Uk has to step in. Mac thinks he can buy his way to reelection? Since he don't know better, he will learn soon. What ever happened to seperation from church and state? This is Cayman but that won't save his foolish backside.
Churches should not be given one red cent from the government coffers, any good Christian will tell you that the church receives 10% from individuals salary. I will agree that some churches do help the less fortunate and they should be given special concessions where necessary. I would like to see all the churches that received money for nation building come together and build a multi purpose center where people can go to seek treatment for addictions, get food supplies when they don't have jobs or money, when the poor will be given the necessary medical treatment and medication that they need. They should provide a place of refuge for those who need shelter for the night. Assist in helping the unemployed find jobs. How about that for nation building? then again the churches and government may call this socialism.
Churches "come together"?
Not likely.
The reason there are so many different christian sects is that they all think they have the "truth". They know what god thinks. All of the others have it wrong.
How disgustingly prideful.
Pride……it's saten's favourite sin.
People, there are many churches with special services such as education, and West Bay has some good examples.
So I hope these excellent schools such as Wesleyan Christian Academy will be receiving some financial benefit for the good work they do.
Many churches with special services, yet only one was mentioned. The Wesleyan Christian Academy. And this just happens to be the church that I and our dear leader "Mr. Premier" attends. "You" whomever you are that wrote this biased piece' should get on your knees and ask God forgiveness for making such a bold and untruthful statement.
"Excellent!" Did I hear you say Excellent? From what I'm told this did apply at one time! But now under t the "current pastor" there were changes made to the detriment of the school to such an extent that some parents [ my family included] have now taken their children out and placed them in another institution. This! all because the present New Pastor seems to have a propensity for dictating to you [the board] and others like you what he wants done and how & when;
What gets me is, that although there's a sitting board which should be making decisions involving the church and the running of the school, he apparently dictates to the board what they must do, including but not limited to such things as getting rid of a long serving School Principle which 90% of the members adored and who were gravely saddened by her departure, even after the many pleas by the majority of the membership.
Removing her after many years of dedicated service, was the gift of appreciation that was given her by the pastor and his board of "yes men and women". If the people of this church "our church" really care about the image we portray to the world, please write a letter duly signed by the membership [ which I think we'll have a majority of members] and state your displeasure with the current state of affairs and ask for a New Pastor which should be vetted and approved by a new board of directors who will be voted in by the majority of members. And if any of the present board want to leave the church because of this , we will miss them perhaps, but I think the Church will be better off for having made this decision.
God Bless our Church!
Surely, if God wants to destroy your church, all the hurricane-proofing in the world won't make a difference?!
As we can see, McKeeva is not God-fearing, the only thing he fears is not getting re-elected and he is even trying to buy out God! Here they skimping on paying civil servants their pensions, and/or salaries, CUC digging our eyeballs out of our heads ($300 light bill on a STUDIO APARTMENT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!), our children are graduating high-school with enough brain to get them a yard job and Big Mac spending money supporting churches!
Believe me, I love God, I have many days gotten by only on prayer, but I am sure even God shut his blinds on this one! McKeeva, even angels will protest at the pearly gates if so much as your initials are in the Book of Life!!!
WOW. Talk about livin' large! Giving it away like it's his, to whoever he feels.
21st century Despot
Outside Hurleys today there were two hard working volunteers collecting money for a charity for poor children to get a good breakfast in Cayman and they were asking people to donate money "every little helps". We gave them our change from shopping but felt like saying "why don't you contact the churches and ask them for money to feed the poor children as they now have $4.1 million".
Well said. Unfortunately, with churches, you have to believe in Jesus andaccept him or at least do so after you have been feed and helped in return. I wonder whatever happen to the non-for-profit service "Meals on Wheels." They don't bother people about they have to be "saved" and accept their faith just to get something to bite.
That is a lie, Libertarian. Many churches give to the needy without demanding that they make a profession of faith in Jesus Christ. You are really on a roll with your anti-Christian propaganda.
If that is the case, accept my apology.
CUT MY SALARY TO GIVE TO THE CHURCHES AND I STILL HAVE TO PAY THITHES?
No sa I need my money back !! -next election -come hell or high tide – they all got to go.Did the churches in West Bay got any? West Bayers you need to help us get ridof this UDP party – and I don't mean any PPM either,
What we need is the "legislative power" of enacting a bill into law, taken out of the hands of our elected MLA's where they will only be able to debate and deliberate on a bill before passage. And then that "legislative power" tranferred solely to the people of these islands, by way of electronic means and technology. As far as we have right now, is a two-party system that represents themselves, favored few in the electorate, and their own interest; and the UK's FCO has left us with a bad Constitution that has no leaning towards direct democracy except for referendums. We are not represented in our own country as we should. It would have been better if we were at least annexed or ceded to Canada or some other superpower that would have shown us a little more interest in our democracy. Because as far as I can see, the British are doing a poor job at it. They have left with some cheap-behind Constitution that gives more power to 15 people than to the populous of these islands, and the document is estranged from the modern times and technology of this age.
GIVING MONEY TO CHURCHES; una don't worry – Election soon come. I wonder how many of those preachers gave back any thing to the community in return – ya right!!!
Some of them don't even stay in church long enough to know who their members are- I enquired and my church never got a dime. I wondered why? Oh I forgot our church is mostly made up of 100% real born and bred Caymanians–no 2003 status grants are in there. Shame on Mike Adams- make good of your salary for these four years-What a surprise UDP and PPM is going to get come next election.
But I don't want either Ezzard or Arden to be our premier – Ezzard, Alden and Arden same o' same O.
Ezzard holds no respect for the Governor, the Queen and will use what ever it takes to be heard likewise Alden, while he does display some degree of respect for these two, he is still strong headed like Mckeva – andas for Arden, he will help them blow the whistles when they are needed- Lord Help Us>
Is this Mac's personal money fund?
Money he can give to anyone for any purpose as decided by him alone? Money with which he can buy political influence for himself, and obligate the lucky receivers?
Surely, taxpayer's funds should be distributed by taxpayer's representatives, voting publically in parliament,
Hmmm, can't help but wonder how much of Mr. Bush's own money he donates towards the churches. It's probably more like…."Hell, why use mine? I'll use the people's."
He should be pleading to the people and giving speeches for donations. Instead he "takes" from the people, and nothing can be done about it, because the people elected him for four long years. It's called Representative Democracy, you elect and give power to someone to represent you for four years. Once the keys of the kingdom, is handed over, there is pretty much very little you can do, except bear much with theelected politicians. Some have suggested shortening the term in office to two years, and the elected Premier, can be elected no more than two terms, since the Cayman Islands is a small place .But experience teaches me that even for less than one year, the damage bad policies can be extensive when power is in one man's hands.
The 4 million he gave the churches is HIS dilinquent tithe from before he got "saved" since the beginning of his civil service career, and of course since he is our king and dictator, I guess he considers the money his own whether it's in a public funds account or not.
"Render therefore unto Caesar the things which are Caesar's; and unto God the things that are God's."
God is with a congregation whether they are perched under a shady tree or on the beach, God is in no way seduced by stain glassed windows, double doors, beautifully painted walls and well-polished solid wood pews!!!!
If we had any decent, well-meaning, honest, holy churches they would have turned that money down or taken it and donated it to "Feed the Children", Haiti, red cross!!! Preaching from the Bible and not reading it themselves!
Jesus ministered sitting on a rock, our pastors need thousand dollar pulpits, Jesus walked MILES from place to place to spread the word, some of our pastors driving BMW's, Jesus spoke of peace and love, a kind and caring, forgiving Heavenly Father, our pastors are teaching us that God will damn us to burn in hell if we don't pay 10% of our few dollars every month or show up each Sunday to hear them preach the word the way THEY interpret it.
Remember the story of the widow? She gave Jesus ALL she had and He treasured it more thanthe money the rich gave from their full purses, McKeeva if you have REALLY been reading your Bible I don't know why you would think God would look at this deed as one which is genuine and for which you deserve praise as he also looks upon your suffering country-men, misguided youth, deteriorating community and unhappy society for which YOU declared yourself able to rule and guide. Let's not forget our elderly (which are really almost forgotten!)
The Premier arrived at the Pearly Gates and confidently told St Peter:
'Please let me in because my hands are clean and my heart is pure. And I gave a lot of money to the churches'.
'Not so fast says St Peter – whose money was it that you gave to the Churches?'
'The peoples money sir'
'I know. The last one I let into heaven from your island told me that he died from stress because of the high taxes you imposed. And the one before him begged me to send you straight to hell'
And so to be fair to you both I will let you take the round about way to hell rather than sending you on the straight road there, but don’t worry because you will meet several of your preacher friends on that road too'.
'Just keep following the signs with the smiling red man waving the fork'!
I was a UDP up to this last election, because PPM made a mess, and hoping that the next rulers would had made a difference in our lives I supported the UDP government–None of you are any better than the other one. In regards to the premier givining out money to churches without a need, is an insult to most christians. If per chance a church gets in distress- yes the government should assist them whenthe church ask, because the church aught to play a role in the molding of our young people. Sad to say this is far fetch, most churches have excluded themselves from the community. Churches themselves are on a political battle ground – they conduct themselves just like the legislative assembly – politics in high place- therefore, for the Premier to justify cutting salary etc, with civil servants and statutory bodies, and giving it to churches makes it a crying shame. Civil Servants and Statutories Bodies employees can hardly feed their families. The UDP Government need to stop buying votes for the next election. Remember half of these churches are run by different nationalities, and I suppose many of them are filled with the 2003 status grant Caymanians. UDP please consider what you are doing, (why you are doing it – to buy votes? ) and think about rolling back some of these unnecassary increase that you have imposed on the poor pople.
My friend, it doesn't if it is UDP, PPM, or Independent, a politician will always ensure that those who voted them in, will do so again. Also, they will do all they can to "buy the votes" and win people on their side. If they don't then they risk the chance of the opposition getting more votes than them. It is how you play the game. The only way out of this, is to amend the Constitution and implement an electronic direct democracy, where the legislative powers will be taken out of the hands of the elected MLA's. Hence they will only be able to debate, make proposals, et cetera… but we have so much ATM machines and computers here, the legislating can be done by the people electronically who are interested in the countries governance. The UK can always still have their sovereignty over the Cayman Islands as its oversight of foreign affairs and good governance. It is just the amendment of the Constitution we need if we want "all" the people who love this island to be represented. Right now, for four long years, 15 people in powercall all the shots, but the times change, and people needs do change with the times. That is why the constitutional system under the UK is not working. It is not democratic enough!
It is very teribble that by cutting the Civil Servants salary adn not giving some of them a raise in pay, the Civil Servant effective have had to foot the bill for McKeeva relection campaign. Bacause that is the only reason that McKeeva is giving them money. It is an utter disgrace!
Now, are you saying that you're PPM next election? Because, as you admit, they made a mess whilst in power. So how are you going to vote next time – for a bunch of proven losers or a bunch of vote-buyers? I'm in the same boat, friend. What a quandry!
Ifthe worst that could be said about the present govt. is that they bought votes that would not be so bad but they make the PPM look good. At the rate they are going we may not even get to vote in elections if the British govt. intervenes like in TCI.
Did ALL churches get money, or only the F.O.P.'s (Friends Of Premier)?
Only selected churches for after school programs, social works, and emergency services, which are all good and noble reasons. I commend the Premier for working with Mike Adam in ensuring that the community gets the social helps it needs. However, what I am dissappointed about, is the intermingling between faith-based private entities and the current government. We have to be careful. There needs to be a clear cut separation between Church and State.
Hey, I like your abbrevation ("f.o.p ') That's exactly what our fore-fathers would call this bunch of representitaves on both sides ——fops—–old caymanian slang. ( "ya lil fop ya, come here") the only difference now, the old folks would beat the hell out of ya- for doing wrong -especially taking goods or earnings from others.
The Premier seems to be quite confused about his position. This is one example. He should be reminded if he's capable of understanding that it is not "his" country. And further it is not "his" money to do with as he pleases. In any event:
"The God I Believe In Isn't Short Of Cash" – Bono
Continue believing in your powerful God, but this island does belong to McKeeva, because in 2009, we voted for him, and he had the majority. Our Uk' Constitution is set-up in a way that whosoever we vote into office, has the power to make decisions for the electorate – and that, for four long years!
We need to stop blaming everything on the Premier —say the UDP party->McKeva do what the party tells him to do.. Don't be fooled by none of their ghosts. they are all alike- buying votes.
SAY WHA???? McKeeva do "what the PARTY TELLS HIM TO??" you hit yo head, or wha??? McKeeva do what McKeeva WANTS TO DO…NOT What any ONE or any PARTY tells him do… Get it STRAIGHT!!!
Serious XXX? What joke our country has become. Rather than just wasting time on here Cayman (even though it's a worthwhile service for sure) why can't you see that his Mac-ness and Julia O'my goodness that's a nice new SUV are laughing at you? The next election is not soon enough, because you'll be whining about those you vote in as well. DO SOMETHING NOW!
And yes, whiners, I have.
If were going to let Mac spend our hard earned cash, why don't we just drop it on his front porch?
How does the Leader of Government get away with such vague answers as to where a large sum of money is dispursed? It seems like the Cayman Islands bank account is Mac's petty cash box. Who signs signs these cheques? How does he get approval for such expenditures? These questions were asked last time he was in power and now we are just repeating speculations fueled by inconsistency, lies, and cover-ups. This financial dictatorship has got to stop. Is this what you want from your Leader, Cayman? Instead of asking after-the-fact questions and listening to lame justifications, let's stop this before he spends another one of our hard earned dollars on a "private museum", or lost wages for a handful of workers. What about your brother, uncle, or cousin? Did they get compensation?
"How does he get approval for such expenditures?"
By the majority of the House being UDP.
If PPM was in power, you would have to deal with the same thing for 4 long years.
I often wondered why our politicians and churches are so mum on the crime situation. Well I guess I now know the answer.
Tow the line and be rewarded handsomely.
If Finance committee is voting Public funds for this reason then we need to change the entire set of Politicians we now have. They all seem to be responsible for letting this ignorance happen.
The only hope for the people's representation, is an amended Constitution. I recall even McKeeva Bush opposed the implementation of our Constitution, saying it was too fast and still needed more deliberations and educating the public. But this document was tethered with our General Elections in 2009, and people being influenced by partisan rhetoric at the time, were not able to make a sound decision. We have a Constitution that gave these powers to the Premier, and here is the elected Premier, saying, "I told you so"
It's like manna from Heaven, Oops, I mean our pockets. God does work in mysterious ways.
The Premier is not made of teflon. Surely there is an ethical or legal violation here. Can't the Judicial Branch or a member of the opposition hold him accountable and bring proper charges to put a halt to such frivolous behavior? If laws don't exist to deal with this type of action then we need to pass some new laws with stiff penalties built in that do.
i DEMAND a response from the governor….and if not…… i DEMAND that the media in cayman follows this up to the very highest level…….
Typical Caymanian response. I demand (fill in the blank) because this is my island.
In most other countrys (where the others come from) a demand is followed by the work it takes to get it done. Here its followed by complaining because its not getting done.
Jesus saves and McKeeva pays!
I feel so sorry for all those poor fools sitting in the pews every Sunday. Their food, utilities and other living expenses are outrageously expensive because government taxes the hell out of everything, then they give 10 percent of their income to these ridiculous holy men WHO ALSO GET A CUTOF THAT MONEY THEIR FLOCK ALREADY SPENT ON FOOD, UTILITIES AND OTHER LIVING EXPENSES!
It's obvioulsy immoral to do this to poor and middleclass Caymanians but isn't it somehow illegal too?
Please, will some lawyer who was planning to leave the island soon anyway look into this before he or she goes?
Wouldn't it be great if god was real and there really was a hell? It would be so cool if the crooks actually had to pay for their crimes one day. But of course they will probably die comfortably of old age while sleeping on silk sheets in mansions. No justice.
Can someone please tell me why a hurch needs that kind of money??? Seriously, churches collect and collect money all year long, are exempt from all kinds of fees and you never hear that they are assisting the community with anything! No youth programs, counselling, donations or community projects!!! This would have been better given to our non-profit organisations!!!
What complete rubbish. If you don't hear about it it is because Christians are not supposed to be self-promotional. But there are many charitable endeavours done by churches all the time. For example, there are after-school programmes provided for children with light snacks in an environment where the children can complete their homework in some cases have assistance to do so. There are many vibrant youth programs which keep youth off the streets and out of trouble. Charity is given to the needy in terms of food items. Informal counselling happens all the time. Please don't make categorical statements from a position of complete ignorance.
Shouldn't these churches first sell their rental properties, parking lots and other non-religious assets first, before we cut on salaries and increase fees ?
I am disgusted by this XXXX you call a premier. Why would he be reluctant to disclose this gift? You got something to hide, idiot ??
A quick calculation means 40$ per church visitor per month, so pay your own bills and don't ask us for it.
Most of this money disappears in contractors pockets for maintenance and upgrades.
In the end it is all about buying votes.
The good thing about it though, is that it proofs the ignorance of the religious people.
$4 million dollars to 19 churchesis giving away in excess of $200,000.00 per church. I can understand government donating the occassional $5 or 10 thousand dollars to individual churches but in excess of $200,000.00 per church is very simply ridiculous while at the same time the same government is crying its heart out that we're broke and jacking fuel taxes through the stratosphere. Something is very radically wrong here folks. These churches should be made to publicly account for how every penny of this money was spent.
Thats right, and they should be made to 'confess' as to whether they even RECIEVED it.
Time for these people stop taking our money to help their cronies while we suffer, as this is all this is.
Show us exactly what these "donations" to churches are!
First we need to determine if the money actually went to the churches.
We would hope that at least there was some equity in the distribution of the $4+ million handed out to these institutions. But was there? I was told by a member of the Wesleyan Church that they received somewhere in the neighborhood of &150,000.00 which was used to purchase an adjoining piece of property that will be used for the construction of a multi purpose hall, perhaps another hurricane shelter! Nothing wrong with hurricane shelters but are they all necessary?
Was there any MOUs signed with these institutions stipulating that the funds had to be used for specific projects connected with the church? The reason I ask the question is that, I was told that $150,000.00 was also given to the Seventh Day Adventists, to build a church on a vacant lot across from the West Bay Police Station. Why?
This makes no sense to me because there are at least five churches within a one mile radius in that area. We don't need more church buildings! What we need are more true religious leaders and teachers. Now! According to The Marl Road these funds that were given to the SDAC has disappeared along with the preacher. Is this the case? If so, who is at fault? Again if there's any truth to any of these rumors, it proves to me that some and I emphasize the word "SOME" of this Church building business has little to do with the spreading Gods word, but more to do with places to indoctrinate the poor and collect their hard earned wages.
These mostly poor, trusting, and God fearing citizens of this Island are the True Christians, not those who stand on the pulpit on a Sunday morningwith their slick expensive suits down to the kerchief in the lapel, and shiny Bruno Magli shoes, these are the Great Pretenders, they have little to do with the true teachings of Jesus Christ. What they are more interested in, and are very good at is the intimidation of their flock thru scare tactics, which say that if they don't give that 10% or more to the church, then there will be no blessing forthcoming. This should not be! Especially in these times when everyone is struggling to feed their families.
Start promoting the true teaching of Jesus, and stop this farce that is being perpetrated on the poorest of our poor. Why do some of these so called men of God need homes that cost millions of dollars, why do they need the most expensive cars, boats and planes? Why all the expensive jewelry, and other unnecessary baubles that has nothing to do with spreading Gods word?
The saddest thing about all this is, that from the pulpit the trusting flock are told that if they keep giving their money to "THIS MINISTRY" they too will become materially wealthy! There are even rumors that some of these so called places of worship are used to launder illegal profits. Is this true? One has to wonder when you pass by some of the large new edifices on sunday after sunday, where on inside there maybe ten people. Makes one wonder!
Anyway, it's not my intention to disparage the Church nor the good leaders and teachers of Gods word, but until the true christians of this Island start speaking out about these things, and others that are causing people {young people especially] to lose faith in our Religious Institutions nothing will change. As the good book says "NOT EVERYONE THAT COMETH IN MY NAME". "THINK"
Firstly, as a God dearing person I have offered a prayer for you and hope that you will allow the true God to change your heart. Ignorance is not bliss regardless of what some may say. I know that denominational policy of the worldwide SDA church does not allow the pastor any access to bank accounts or funds collected, and I do know that WB SDA church received funds from the government which is safely deposited in a bank account locally waiting for planning permission to commence. However, if you or CNS want to ask for more info maybe you can ask the government and the Cayman Islands Conference of Seventh-day Adventist for more info. For obvious reasons I will not answer other blog messages in relation to this type of marl road rubbish.
I was hoping for an answer to the question, why the need for another church in that area. Are you saying that the other five or six churches aren't doing a good job. You prove my point. You mentioned that I should allow the true God to change my heart, this is the kind of arrogance that exists in your church, such as that all other christian denominations are wrong because they do not worship on {the sabbath] Saturday. If you truly knew your bible, you will have known that there were several sabbaths mentioned in the bible. How do you know that you are keeping the right one. One of the greatest problems that exists in the Christian Religious World is, that most of them think the others are wrong in their teachings and/or their mode of worship. Did you know that it was the Seventh-Day Adventists that predicted the Second Coming of our lord and saviour in the year 1844. Do they teach that in church? Just to say . Be Humble! And God bless.
Hello… Something is WRONG with this picture, don't we think?
Time to call a spade a spade…
Let me get this right…
Our "righteous" leader Mac-a-whack saw fit to take public funds and give them to the influential leaders of large masses of the population under the guise of supporting said organizations without suspecting in the least that the result would be the very same leaders might inadvertantly encourage their "flock" to "flock" to support the leadr himself… In any other situation, this would be labelled what it is – XXXXXX AND XXXXX. In Cayman, it is "Nation Building" – but I would go beyond that to say more like "Nation Destroying".
If I was a member of any of the churches receiving said funds, I would be embarrassed to have been so blatently used. Not only would I stand up for the right decision and refuse to be influenced by the money, but I would go a step further and question my leader for his accepting the funds.
Anyone sitting by and taking the money of the people while being used as a puppet in the games of our dicKtatorial leader should be ashamed and embarrassed. Don't just stand up for what is right and refuse to vote for money, stand up for what is right and turn your back on the money grabbing leaders of your churches who have sold your souls to the devil, prostituted your vote and been as evil as the leader himself in this picture.
Everyone should speak out, act out, vote out – turn your back on the leader for his pious ploy and turn your back on the churches for allowing you to be used. There are many many other religious institutions on this island who exist for the true worship of God, not the worship of the "god – the money"…
If the congregations step up and speak out, perhaps their "john" leaders will stop using you as pawns in the political arena. If they see their masses rebelling and threatening to withdraw their support, perhaps the church leaders will take the moral high road and refuse the funds of the Cayman Islands' people being used for political gain.
As far as I know, I am not a member of any church that has benefitted from this dirty, virtual Judas Iscariot of funding, but if I were, I would turn and run. And if any of them seek outside support from me or my company for a fundraiser, they had better be prepared to hear about their hypocrasy and betrayal.
"The love of money is the root of all evil" and it seems more evident than ever that our own pastoral leaders are as suckered into this as anyone.
Prayer works. Right?
All they have to do is pray and their goals towards goodness and holiness wil magically happen.
They do not need government money.
It's not Government money. Its Mac's money. Please get your facts right. By the way, God IS answering their prayers by using his messenger to increase our fuel taxes so he can 'build our nation'. Surely you're not questioning God's ways and means, are you?
I would like to see a break down of these churches and how much they got. there are churches on this island that thier members chase the udp goverment where ever they go. i would like to know how much the church on northwest point got, the church in boatswain, the church on eastern ave by uncle , the churck in the swamp, and the church on north sound road. i will bet anybpdy the churches east end and north side EXCEPT WILLIAMPAGERO CHURCH NEVER GOT any of this money. IF i had some money i would challenge the nightmare in court, i hope the AG can give us a break down. or thei is why the PMFL has been change so we will never know. how dear the nightmare to give money for scolarships when we have a department for doing that. i wonderif MR ANGLIN IS NOT DIONG HIS JOB
I see a FOI request coming…. wonder who it will be from this time… perhaps Peter Pan
Peter Pan is a fitting name. Like Peter Pan, Cayman is having trouble growing up.
The worst part of all this is that God is not even real!
What we have here is a politician giving the people's money to institutions that exist to serve an imaginary being.
Crazy!
My Friend,
I hope for your saddened sake that God is not real.
He keeps getting McKeeva re-elected so he must be real.
A fool in his heart has said their is no GOD,I wonder if you were on a jet that was about to crash what would be the first words out of your mouth.oh my GOD.
I understand the importance of the Separation of Church and State. Nevertheless, in response to your atheistic claim. Do you know it takes "faith" to also say there is no God? Do you have the evidence to say there is no God? People make claims of experiencing "revelations" of a supreme God everyday; some atheists on their death beds make the claim. And the good thing about it all, that sublimed experience, can never be expressed by words nor understood by another person. Such things, should humble you to the fact that you don't know everything about existence. Regards
I just LOVE the 'well known private museum' bundle o cash
Keep investigating, Governor!
You mean "start investigating, governor"… He only announced the police are investigating the "real estate bill" (XXXX). The governor has yet to get off his royal a$$ and look into a thing. Me thinks he is either, a, enjoying his retirement outpost, b, giving us enough rope to hang ourselves and then ready to swing in with the mother country by his side, or c, blissfully ignorant that such blatent misgovernment could exist here…
Any votes???
oohh…investigating???? thats why he says nothing??……zzzzzzzzzzzzzz
This is absolutely ridiculous, giving $4million to churches when money should be giving to social services programmes such as fighting teenage pregnancy which is a huge problem in Cayman, child abuse, underage drinking and drug use, tackling domestic violence and support sports. Mac knows where he's putting the money becausethis a notch up his belt to get votes, I'm sure Wesleyan Holiness Church where he's a supposed elder will be well supported. How can you reduce crime when money isn't spent in the right areas to promote positive influence instead of looking at political gains and wasting tax payers money. We have a young lady who has disappeared and the RCIPS can't even find any clues on a island that's 76 sq miles, why not put money into bringing in specialist detectives.
Mac, you need to see that you're put in a position to represent the people and not look at what is good for the UDP and your friends. I'm so upset that I'm starting to believe that he doesn't care anymore about the future of Cayman as long as his shortterm gains are made, so typical arrogance. Churches aren't speaking out on violence and supporting the community enough and I know I'll get the religous praisers giving me stick yet don't be blinded by your light. Education is seriously lacking in Cayman and this where money needs to be spent. I'm not against churches yet Cayman has way too many and many is just about making money.
Blessings to all,
"Where else would we get the enduring ethical guidance that our churches continue to urge upon us?”
Perhaps he should save the money and just spend more time on CNS. We've been urging him to be ethical here for a long time and its free!!!!
Ppl let's try to be understanding of Sir Bush he is trying to correct all his wrongs with God. $$$ can't buy love McKeeva not even from Jesus.
Come on now, if you already had a contract signed with Lucifer, you would be much more interested in pleasing him than God, wouldn't you?
I can't in the name of God, see how this is helping our Island with so many people suffering, have no jobs, can't buy food to feed their kids, can't pay their bills, and here it is Gov. giving money to the churches. The churches and their leaders have big bank accounts, and their church members pay 10% tithes every month. I say shame on all the pastors that took money from gov.,I feel this is not right or can not be justified, Gov. should give back the pay cut to the cs and alot more money to the social service dept., so they can help the poor people of this Island. The little hand out that the MLA's give out now and then cannot, I repeat cannot help the people, may be they can buy some bread and milk, but for how long. I think it's a crying shame that this is happening, the churches do not need money to build more churches, what they need to do is finish the high school, because I can tell you all something, I don't know where they are going to put all these expat children that I saw in the compass a few week ago. I believe our children should come first before the churches. THEY ARE BUILDING IVORY TOWERS AND THE CHURCH PEOPLE ARE RUNNING FROM CHURCH TO CHURCH BECAUSE THEY DON'T LIKE THIS PASTOR OR THAT PASTOR, AND THE CHURCHES ARE SEEING LESS AND LESS PEOPLE, BECAUSE THEY RATHER STAY AT HOME AND WATCH BENNY HINN ON TBN AND JOEL OSTEEN. GOD HELP US ALL.
What is the foolishness I read again?? You mean to tell me he donated our money to the church to tally up votes verses giving it back to us to pay our CUC bills?? Sir Bush we might as well call you Premier Ice Cube cause you are a cold XXXX!!
If I am correct, Churches do not need any due diligence performed on them. Therefore, any crook can hide their money in the Church or channel it through the churches. Then wouldn't that be wrong for the Churches to accept money from a Politician? Especially money that is for the Public and the people did not approved it to be donated to the Church? Things that make you say Hmmmmmm!
Shouldnt he be paying the country's debt?? Or at least hiring some special task force to deal with all the crime??? Seriously, there are really more needy ways in which this money could have been applied.
Jesus Saves. I guess we all just made a deposit to his savings account.
Lord…..deliver us from McKeeva Bush. Amen
Praise the Lord.
deliver us from evil…..
Same thing, no?
That is a 'hell' of a lot of money to pay for votes!
Especially when it's not HIS Money.
Nineteen different churches, with congregations averaging say 200 people, that would translate to at least 3,000 votes, not including relatives and friends, who are also undoubtedly being influenced. Does that mean WE paid $4M of OUR very hard earned dollars to keep the UDP in power? And we are continuing to do so?
Of all the churches I wonder if any went to the Luthern church. I hope not as it meets every Sunday at the Ritz-Carlton. But there again I would not be surprised knowing the parties involved.
Yes thats exactly what that means. Get used to it. Its the Cayman way.
We usedto call this BUYING VOTES. But the UDP a.k.a. McKeeva, calls it Nation Building so that the poor Auditor General has a difficult time doing an Audit.
Trust me when we got a Government that has money for churches, money for a Turtle Farm and none for a High School we got a serious problem. We can keep looking the other way but we are heading in the wrong direction and we will soon end up in sheet Creek.
In the case of the Bodden Town Church of God acting also as a Hurricane shelter. Was not the Frank Sound School being built for that very SAME reason? Is this just an act of undoing what the PPM was doing? I still think that money should go towards opening a soup kitchen and feeding the hungry and asisting the poor with their utilities bill. Just saying!
No worries… It won't be for long you hear all the Pastors and Ministers attempt to justify themselves in saying that Cayman is a Christian Culture, and government is preserving the heritage by their donations like the National Trust. Besides, they have a narrow Bill of Rights on their side, implemented in our new Constitution, which starts off saying that Cayman is a Christian Nation and morality is based off Christian principles. Trust me… it won't be too long you hear them attempt to justify the union of Church & State.
Bodden Town is the fastest growing district in Cayman. It includes Savannah, Bodden Town and Breakers.
How many people do you think can fit inside one shelter. Do you want everyone in your district in one hurricane shelter?
The PPM- even during Alden's spending spree which includes the still incomplete Frank Sound School, approached the Bodden Town Church asking them to upgrade their plans for a multi-purpose hall to a Category 5 Hurricane Shelter.
So the PPM weren't undoing their own plans, they were simply trying to provide more shelter space for a district that virtually has NONE!
Big Mac thinks that you are all idiots. And until you do something about him and his cohorts at the next elections, he is correct. The Beaver
I hope all these churches will pray for a lil sense for him!
Shhh. They'll probably need more money to do that. And I guarantee you even with ninteen churches praying its a complete waste of time.
XXX McKeeva and ALLLLL that he does, he just annoys me so much I'm so SICK of him. I swear he just wakes up in the middle of the night and comes up with these plans!!
Maybe he wants to mess everything up so that he can retire a Premier and get the pension, pay, protection, and whatever other benefits he will get after XXX the whole country up.
He's already getting pension dear!
Please give the WB SDA li'l more because even though Gov''t gave them property after Hurricane Ivan they still can't seem to come up with enough $ to build a sanctuary and so, seven years after, still meet at the SJACPS Hall. I wonder how much they pay for using it.
They pay ABSOLUTELY NOTHING and they get to meet there every week, run the a/c and we get to pay for all of it!!!!!!!!
"THINK". When we had fewer churches, we had fewer crimes committed on this Island. Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against churches as a whole. Just those that take advantage. There is a church practically on every corner , being called by whatever name they think will attract those innocent people genuinely seeking for truth; Unfortunately a lot of these persons who claim to be men and women of God, are taking advantage of these mostly poor, innocent, trusting persons, who believe that whatever they are told by these so called leaders of the church is what God wants them to do. Such as when they are told that they should give the church 10% {sometimes they are asked for more} of whatever they earn monetarily on a weekly basis. Where doe's this money go, and what is it used for. Seldom is this information disclosed [tif at all] to the donors. Have you noticed that some of these persons who call themselves men of God live a lot more extravagantly than the average hardworking person. "THINK" Oral Roberts, Jimmy Swaggart, Jim Baker, Benny Hinn and others, men and women; You've seen them on T.V! In fact Mr. Hinn was here not too long ago at the invite of a Popular new comer to the cayman family of churches. Here is a man who claims to have healing powers, and hundreds of our poor innocent believers rushed to hear him speak and hoped for a healing by this miracle worker. Sadly however; Mr. Hinn left our Island without any reports of a miracle healing for anyone, except perhaps himself. That being the miracle of the transformation of a few hours at the pulpit being turned into hundreds of thousands of dollars, which I understand was collected while here and which he was happy to take with him.. Sadly tho people don't seem to lear. Why not leave it for the churches? Why not build a church school that will accept kids who can't afford full tuition? Why not give it to Meals on Wheels? Oh Well! I try to make sure my charitable deeds are to those I know are truly in need. CHARITY BEGINS AT HOME! "THINK"
"When we had fewer churches, we had fewer crimes committed on this Island".
You paint a very cynical view of Churches. We could equally say that when we had fewer expats we had fewer crimes committed on the Island but correlation does not mean causation.
Actually since recently there have been a high number of expats leaving, gun crime has gone up, not down!
Mac and the police force would not agree with that…anyway, maybe it's because we miss them…
Quite obviously not enough of you are leaving.
Fed Up does that mean the expats leaving are not taking their guns.
Clearly the wrong sort are leaving.
They pass around a basket at every service, they instruct each member to give 10% of their earnings, now the Premier is spreading out $4.1 million amongst them. Since with the churches need as economic stimulus!?!!? I don't even have words for how much this sucks.
I will consider Mr. Bush's payment to the church to be my tithe and I expect better things to come my way shortly now that I am paid up.
How is this much different from the recent Qatar vote-buying scandal that has rocked FIFA?
Step 1) Mac gives money to the chuches.
Step 2) The pastors "bless" Mac and encourage the congregation to vote for him.
Result? Mac has more voters on his side.
This is not nation building. These are payments to "centers of influence". In most people's minds this is a thinly veiled vote-buying racket.
I guess there is no seperation of Church & State here in the Cayman Islands…I feel bad for all you hard working people who are being taken for every extra red cent only to have your Master give it to the churches to secure votes to keep him in the lifestyle 99% of you will never have the chance to enjoy! He is supposed to work for you! You tell him what to do with your hard earned money! WAKE UP!
It matters not where the money went but how it got there….what public announcement was there that any organisation or person could apply (or still can apply) for such grants etc. I do not remember any announcement of an application process…If there is a "Nation Building Fund" this should be a fund that anyone can apply to for funds, the application should be required to justify set criteria including why the funds are needed and why the funds should be provided from a public source…and applications should be scrutinised and agreed in an open and transparent way. Although there is nothing to say this didn't happen in some limited way this appears to be some form of "being in the know"…and yes I am sure civil servants today are delighted to know that their pay cut (on-going – now for 2 years) went someway to subsidising undisclosed church programs. Also of note is that this money was used to settle legal claims? And possibly to subsidise a "private museum"? Hopefully not for the private gain of an individual? A grant to the Pines is to be applauded, but provision for elderly care should surely be funded on a more stable basis than this? If there is nothing to hide, why not publish the list of all recipients, perhaps the only case for anonimity is the names of students receiving grants, but without any transperancy how can it be assumed that even the recipients of these personal grants were the most deserving and that everyone who was "eligible" knew about this quazi scheme and was also able to apply and have the same chance as others?
In Mr. Bush's dictionary, "transparency" is a four letter word.
Why would the Premier have to duplicate scholarships? Scholarships fall under the ambit of the Ministry of Education. What a web he weaves, who the hxxx he thinks he can deceive? God is looking down on the just and the unjust, not just the so call Christians.
I guess Mr. Doofy never thought that $$$ could be better used to aid people really struggling or unemployed. What a useless turd he is.
Thank you Mr. Bush. Now there are multiple places where I can go to get the help of God to save this country.
I had no idea God required monetary assistance to do his works.
"The God I believe in isn't short of cash, mister." – Bono
Well if the extra money will bring in more people, then I say yes. However, if the (now) infamous church on NWP road is any example of what happens when you get extra money in the "offering" plate, then forget about it!! Cuz I still waiting to see their church full! Only time you see that happen is when there is a funeral on!!!
why is it infamous?
Church of God in Bodden, Pastor Winston Rose's church is also getting government contribution. "the 20,672 square feet single storey building is being constructed just past the Bodden Town Primary School on four acres of church property and it is a working partnership between the church and the government which is estimated to cost just under CI$4 million when completed. The building is being built to an elevation of 14 feet with hurricane resistant impact windows and doors, which is the government’s requirement and will accommodate more than 500 persons. The building will feature kitchen, office and storage, rest room areas with showers; a waste water treatment plant, and a 60,000-gallon water cistern… [says Pastor Rose] 'Most of the walls are up and we are now in the process of putting up the roof… We had to make some changes because some steel had deteriorated, which had to be replaced. We are pouring for the tresses, then the doors and rendering will take place. The next big item of expense which would be the generator plant which will carry the load of the building in case power is lost.'" See this article in the CayCompass: http://www.compasscayman.com/caycompass/2011/07/27/Pastor-offers-explanation–for-multipurpose-hall-funding/ Our government is giving Pastor Rose's church, the same church Ms. Mary Lawrence attends, more than a million dollars. Get it! Now if that's not something I don't know what is! Don't get me wrong, Pastor Rose and Ms. Mary Lawrence, are decent citizens. I believe in helping people for a good cause, but shouldn't that be left with the private sector instead of taxpayers monies?
Libertarian, I think you need to treat the issue fairly. You have give an edited account of the partnership. It is not about giving churches millions of dollars. The BT Church of God had already initiated plans to construct a new sanctuary and hall when it was approached by the Govt. with the offer of a partnership whereby the building could serve the dual purpose of a hurricane shelter. However, in order to serve that purpose a number of expensive upgrades would be required. Govt's contribution represents the cost of those upgrades as determined by the Govt. quantity surveyor. While it is substantial it is certainly a great deal less than if Govt. were to acquire its own property and build a shelter on its own. Take the cost of the Hurricane Hilton as a comparison. It seems that the partnership has in fact saved the public purse.
Incidentally, I don't think Mrs. Lawrence regularly attends church there or anywhere else.
I could be wrong, but I sincerely believe Ms. Lawrence attends that church. About the Hurricane Hilton, I understand that the material for the project was a bit too costly. However, I never had no issue with the public funding for it. But to help a church, a private entity, and leave out the other churches and faith bodies in the Cayman Islands, is to me, problematic in terms of freedom of religion. Such a partnership is wrong.
Ms. Lawrence attends the Moravian Church.
Libertarian get your facts correct before attacking a church will you. Mrs Lawrence is not a regular attender of that church, she used to be.
Also the funding was not to help the church. The Government wanted a hurricane shelter. The church was building their own new church building. The Government approached them to combined the projects. By converting it to a hurricane shelter drove up the cost significantly. The church did not need any help from the GOvernment nor did they go looking for any.
Then you are sincerely wrong.
You are still on painting this as merely helping a private entity and completely ignoring the points I have made. That is not a mark of honesty.
The Hurricane Hilton was not needed. A hurricane shelter in Bodden Town is. I don't understand your reasoning to justify the Hurricane Hilton if you are really concerned about how public funds are expended.
Faith-Based partnerships are also known in the United States. They are not contrary to freedom of religion.
so why is it taking so long?
Anyone checked the make up of their congregation? It surely isn't Bodden Towners/caymanians. If there is a Hurricane, I struggle to see how many B.T. people will fill the halls. A part from that, an multi-purpose hall was supposed to be built next to the B. T. Primary School, but that was aborted by the infamous UDP. It is better and easier to get votes through the church.
When the devil selected his followers he started out with nation builders.
Libertarian I have noticed over time your responses and really you have made generally good contributions, however this one is pathetic. What is more pathetic is all the thumbups you get indicating people who support what you are saying. I guess thats how much the view of the church has deteriorated. I understand that religion has numerous churchs that take advantage of its members and the pastor gets rich off their support. But Pastor Winston Rose?
First lets get it right. Church of God in Bodden Town was quite willing to go and build their new church without Government. It was Government who approched them to convert it to a hurricane shelter. The cost of the church is escalated many times over to make it a hurricane shelter.
As for Mrs Mary Lawrence. Certainly she used to be a regular attender at the church but not so much any more.
Libertarian,
In your attempt to create a political connection between the Church of God Bodden Town and the Government, you have bordered on libelous behaviour. Not that most of those who think like you will care about libeling the individuals you have- because when it comes to Christians and Caymanians we are fair game for pot shots.
Mary Lawrence does not attend the Bodden Town Church of God. She used to attend that congregation many years ago but left over 10 years ago.
The PPM Administration led by Kurt Tibbetts approached the Bodden Town Congregation when they learned of their plans to build a multi purpose hall and new sanctuary on that land the Church had purchased and paid for. Given that the PPM’s plans for additional hurricane shelters and emergency response centres also inBodden Town
What has taken so long in getting off the ground has been a difference in the valuation of that cost difference for the upgrades by Government (PWD's) QS and the private sector QS hired by the Church. However, the committment was made to do so. No actual funds were transferred by the time the PPM left office but the agreement and arrangement was in place and the Church was continuing with a completely different set of plans. The Plans were approved by the CPA during the time of the PPM administration!
The UDP should be credited for continuing not abandoning or tearing down this PPM plan of action. It is for the benefit of the district. All McKeeva has done is honored a commitment to the COMMUNITY ofBODDEN TOWN
The shelter is not for the congregation, but for the people of the community who need a place to stay. The Church does not have 500 members. And many of their members would not need to go to a hurricane shelter during a storm.
I recommend you bark up a different tree. This is not a political project but the next time a cat 3-5 come many people will be thanking God, the Church and the Government for the shelter.
Anonymous,
No one on this site should come close to defaming another person's character – not even the Premier's character, which he has numerous times voiced his complaints to the public. I don't see my behavior here "libelous." However, the good thing about freedom of speech on CNS, is that it is not totally censored. You are able to correct me when I am wrong or about to be in the wrong. Thank you for the correction:
#1 – It is true that Ms. Mary Lawrence did attend the Bodden Town Church of God, but that was over 10 years ago; and,
#2 – It is true that the drafted plans between Pastor Rose and the government, started under PPM's tenure.
Hence, I apologise to everyone on CNS for the errors of this said posting. I want my comments to be as truthful as possible, and I do accept your corrections. However, for the sake of truth, pertaining to the subject of this article, all public funds being used to assist and aid faith-based private entities, is contrary to the Separation of Church and State. The UDP could have still asked for public donations instead of "taking up" taxpayer's monies for this project.
This reminds me of the Christian story of "Rendering unto Ceasar" – Matthew 22 of certain religous leaders that came to Jesus in the temple, plotting on how they might entangled him in his talk to the crowd. This was their opportunity to formulate grounds of blasphemy or rebellion against Jesus, and to stir up the crowd against him. Matthew 22:16-22 states, "Master, we know that you are true, and teach the way of God in truth; nor do you care about anyone, for you do not regard the person of men. Tell us, therefore, what do you think? Is it lawful to pay taxes to Caesar, or not?" But Jesus perceived their wickedness, and said, "Why do you test me, you hypocrites? Show me the tax money." So they brought Him a denarius coin. And Jesus said to them, "Whose image and inscription do you see on this coin?" The plotters replied, "Caesar’s." And He said to them, "Render therefore to Caesar the things that are Caesar’s, and to God the things that are God's." When they had heard these words, they marveled, and left him and went their way.
Their plan was ruined. Whenever I hear stories liken to this one, I am always reminded that Ceasar and Church matters (the things that are God's), should always be separated; or, else something worse down the road, can come out from the unholy union. Don't you see the same interpretation as I do? Kind Regards
here and I thought I'd be spending some time in hell with the Premier. Turns out he's on the fast track to heaven.
Only if Dart can build him a detour.
Nonsense!!! No amount of money can save your soul!
Actually it can. I saw a website that specializes in saving souls. Just send them $500 by cash, credit card or paypal and you receive an official certificate that your soul has been saved. Or just dial 1-800-sav-soul. And it is a tax deduction too, double bonus!
How do you save a soul that doesn't exist?
If you assume it doesn't exist then you certainly cannot save it.
Is one of these churches now going to pay the water bill of the lady that was on TV who is unable to pay her water bill?
I think she'll have to go to Mac's church and drink from the living waters.
Guess that's how Wesleyan Holiness Church, West Bay is getting that new $1.8m multipurpose hall they are gonna start building.
This is so wrong!!! So many people out of jobs and struggling from day to day to survive and take care of their families and McKeeva Bush is giving Churches millions of dollars!!
I am starting to see a trend. Isn't that McKeeva Bush's church?
Fear not Cayman's Christians, what the good Lord is too weak to accomplish, our leader, McKeeva Bush can do!
Who needs miracles and the divine hand of the almighty when there is so much money to siphon away from government coffers?
Funny how God can create life and the universe but he's always short of cash. Hmmmm…
And his son who has been around for 2,000 yrs. experience is also terrible with his finances!
"what would our society have been like; what, in today’s pressured realities would it be like, were it not for our churches? Where else would we get the enduring ethical guidance that our churches continue to urge upon us?” he asked."
Answer: A heck of a lot better off without their dubious ethical guidance.
Just look around you Mr. Bush, if you want to see the results of the current ethical guidance.
Praise the lord
I see no difference in giving taxpayers money to churches, and giving taxpayers money to say, personal friends. Either way Bush is not entitled to give away public money without (a) accountability and (b) a rational, value for money reason that shows it is for the public good. Just because a church is a religious group, that is not by itself any justification to receive public funds, any more than say, a charity or other non-profit organisation. I would be interested in hearing from the Auditor General as to whether Bush has the right under our legislature to do this – even where he originally obtained the funding by entering it into a budget. In any other developed country this would be at best a cause to force resignation / removal and at worse a criminal offence punishable by jail.
Why does everyone sit on their hands and allow such obvious chicanery? Is there no-one in Government who can see that such acts are more than just questionable. I don't mean the back-benchers (I have given up on any of those ever standing up for what is right and good), I mean everyone else involved. Plenty of people know about these transactions.
I can only conclude that generally speaking, people here simply don't know right from wrong. That can surely be the only answer – it just doesn't occur to people in Government, the churches or anyone else that such goings on are wrong, inequitable, unethical, illegal. Can't we at least get a test case in Court for this kind of crap and start educating the nation the hard way?
So if I don't attend one of these churches, there is no shelter for me and my family. And if I do attend to save my own life, I have to sit down and listen to Pastor so and so give a sermon. Just rediculous!
Thank you. I and many others from BT feel the same way as you. Its downright offensive.
BTer why dont you and the many others in BT go and educate yourselves to facts rather than sitting down sulking and running around with your mouth push out like Ha Hee's Donkey. If you a realy Bodden Towner you will know who Ha Hee's Donkey was.
The Shelter is for the community. But if you prefer when the hurricane breeze blows you can call Rooster and complain or write and blog, while the masses seek and find shelter.
You need somebody to come to your house and pack your corn beef and pampers for you too and give you a written invitation to go to one of the district's shelters-hand delivered in an envelope with an RSVP?
You are truly one of BT's finest…
Only a Caymanian would be offended by the operators of a hurricane shelter. I trust if you have a family, that you will put aside your feelings in order to protect them. Better to be offended and alive than blown to bits.
Who says? As with any other hurricane shelter it is there to serve the needs of the community around it rather than the people who happen to be churched there (many of whom will not need a shelter or live in other districts).
Trust in the Lord with all thine heart and lean not unto thine own understanding.
In all thy ways acknowledge him, and he will direct thy path.
Here is a biblical fact:
One of the few times you read of Jesus going into a temple [church] was when he became so angered by the way in which this house of worship was being used, that he took matters into his own hands and chased the money changers from the building. Today we have the same kind of people in our churches doing the same things by using our houses of worship as a means of getting rich! This is not a blanket statement and does not apply to all religious institutions. But those that seem to grow too rapidly and have these massive followings.
Remember Oral Roberts? He was one of the first who purported to have healing power! Then you had the Rev. Jim Jones who convinced hundreds of men women and children to take their own lives in the name of Jesus. Today we have the Rev. Benny Hinn [who was here in the island by the way] never heard of one person being healed , but I understand he left here with hundreds of thousands of dollars. And then there was the "Golden Lady of Brasil" [my description] who exuded flex of gold from her body and this supposedly gave her some healing powers. These people are charlatans, and should never be let into this Island to perpetrate this farce on innocent people. Let's stop this kind of absurdity in our Island. And let us continue to help the church where we can, but when anyone who shows up on this Island Claiming to be a man or woman of God and want to open another church. Please tell them politely that we already have too many churches here.
LUKE:18 v.10-13
10:Two men went into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, the other a publican.
11:The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God I thank thee that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even this Publican.
12: I fast twice in the week,I give tithes of all that I possess.
13: And the Publican standing afar off, would not lift so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, GOD BE MERCIFUL TO ME A SINNER!
"THINK"
Some of the finest educational institutions on our islands are directed connected to and started by churches, and, supported by the members voluntary giving. Catholic School, Prep School, Triple C School, First Baptist Christian School, to name a few.
School fees are charge but the church members giving offset the cost, otherwise fees would simply be very high and unaffordable.
Churches were instrumental in providing free hot food and shelter during Ivan. Afterwards they assisted in rebuilding uninsured homes without cost to anyone who had need, whether they were members or not.
As Jesus said, we must first get the log out of our eyes before we complain about the splinter in our brothers own. The church is not perfect, it's full of flawed people, and we still have room for lots more.
You really don't understand the economics of it. This country is way over its' debt limit which carries a yearly interest paymment of 40 million dollars. If we pay of the debt instead of throwing money at votes then we can have an extra 40 million to use for public funding whether it is through the churches or charitable organizations. When you kill the goose, the golden eggs stop being laid.
I think that you will find that the churches do not subsidise the affiliated schools. At least the one my child attended did not benefit this way. The assistance from the PTA is what subsidised the running of the school and thus helped to control the fees. The church once signed as a surity on a loan but the PTA made the actual payments.
If you are referring to Cayman Prep, the United Church paid around $1,000,000 to rebuild the Walkers Road site after hurricane Gilbert. The PTA does a great job, as does the school of making money and spending money very carefully.
Would representatives of Catholic School, Prep School, Triple C School, First Baptist Christian School care to advise if they have been the recipients of any "Nation Building funding"?
What an absolute disgrace. The country is broke and the Government is wasting money on Churches. Jesus wept.
If this is the case, then where is the public action and statements of both this political leader, Premiere McKeeva Bush and his government-sponsored churches on the biggest moral plague that is now destroying the Cayman Islands ?
RUNAWAY, RAMPANT, VIOLENT CRIME !
“Perhaps the fundamental justification for supporting the churches, however, may be more readily grasped if we ask ourselves this: what would our society have been like; what, in today’s pressured realities would it be like, were it not for our churches? Where else would we get the enduring ethical guidance that our churches continue to urge upon us?” he asked.
If these churches are being paid by Bush for their 'enduring ethical guidance', then someone's being shafted out of big bucks, BIG TIME but it sure ain't Mr. Bush…
It isn't his money, is it ?
Yet another story which, in a properly functioning democracy with a free press and political accountability would see the Premier out of his job within 24 hours.
But in Cayman, a shrug … and everyone moves on.
just another day in woderland
Faith-based Partnerships are also known in the U.S. where there is such a doctrine of separation of church and state.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_House_Office_of_Faith-Based_and_Neighborhood_Partnerships
Omg
I think the genaral responses to Mr Bush's Nation Building exercises, as far as he has revealed them to us, are very cynical. The Churches do a great deal of positive social work, regardless of how one views religion or the separation of church and state. As for the church as Bodden Town that has doubled as a hurricane shelter, it makes perfect sense, and has saved both the church and the Government a lot of money. I have no knowledge of where the rest of the $7 million went, but just as Nature abhors a vacuum, so humans speculate in the absence of facts.
No dear, we already have more churches in BT than grains of sand on the beach. What makes sense is to give us dedicated hurricane facilities and prohibit the building of any more churches.
I'd be rich if I bet on you being a real Caymanian!
Even when you are getting help you are still complaining. So you want a dedicated hurricane shelter- built specifically and only for hurricanes, to be used possibly once maybe twice every year?
And who maintains this? Of course to prevent mould etc we would have to run the A/C right?
Don't you get it? If it isn't connected to a school, or a church or a community activity its an absolute waste of millions of dollars.
Tell you what- go stay at the Civic Centre next time a hurricane blow through- since you don't like hurricane shelters in the district.
While Mr. Bush is handing out monies to churches etc. with one hand his government is cutting grants to many needey NGO's while insistiing they produce the same results for less monies. This is not "Nation Building" it is vote building plain and simple. Many of the needed services suppied by these NGO's are at risk. Wll done Mr. Premier.
It is easy to be generous with other people's money.
A breakdown of these expenses is needed!! That is why we cannot function or have a proper budget. Did anyone else have a say in regards to the distribution of these funds?
Mr Premier if you really want the UK to do to Cayman what they just did to TCI this is the quickest way on the planet to make sure it happens.
I'm not saying for one minute that the churches are not an important part of local society or that they should not be supported but giving them public money, particularly those that are actually run from outside the Cayman Islands, is just plain dumb.
And the Matrix contractors? XXX
I think we need a fully itemised list on all of this, assuming of course that any real records were actually kept. LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Mr Premier if you really want the UK to do to Cayman what they just did to TCI this is the quickest way on the planet to makesure it happens.
I'm not saying for one minute that the churches are not an important part of local society or that they should not be supported but giving them public money, particularly those that are actually run from outside the Cayman Islands, is just plain dumb.
And the Matrix contractors? Are these the same people who were charging the Young Brothers for shifting full loads of scrap but actually running the trucks half empty or was that someone else?
I think we need a fully itemised list on all of this, assuming of course that any real records were actually kept. LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!
If we had Synagogues and Mosques here would they be eligible for the big bucks or is it just for Christian Churches? And what about those Sun worshipers?
Well we don't so that it is a pointless question.
Of course not. They pray to a different Invisible Man than Mac prays to.
Since there is no separation of Church & State I believe it would be a great idea if the Churches were to take up collections during Sunday Service to help paydown the government debt.
This one-way street is the epitomy of stupidity.
The true church is not a building, but a body of believers who love each other with a supernatural love derived from their common bond in Christ.
Many of the brethren are suffering lack and want and we would be much better off taking care of them rather than building these religious empires where we fleece the people every week, sometimes twice. Churches are full of controlling people who have positions of authority yet little of Christ.
I wonder if the rain is really the tears of God? Jesus said it all when he looked out over Jerusalem, "Woe to you, you did not even acknowledge your time of visitation and now your house is left desolate. There will not be left standing one stone upon another."
Not only was he speaking to Jerusalem of old, but His words are a stark warning to those of us that think church is a substitute for serving the Living God. May God help us.
Rain is God's tears? Maybe, but I do know that thunder is God bowling.
"God helps those who help themselves" Not help themselves to our money. I am not condeming the churches for taking this gift, I am condeming Mr. Bush for not using the 10 million dollars to reduce our national debt which carries a 40 million dollars per year interest payment. Only when the debt is gone should our money be used frivolously without our permission.
Dear Mr. Bush.
I have started a church. With your help (financial assistance) I am certain this church can meet the physical and spiritual needs of Grand Cayman's people – well, at least one of them (me).
Please letme know when I can come pick up my check.
Look man, this is OUR money and we not only deserve to know, but have the right to know how it is being spent, and I mean every cent.
Who gives this man the right to take our money and give it to who he wants without us knowing where it is going.
I hope you realize that without him stating where the money was spent, it could have been spent on sureing up votes by certain favours.
Does this mean that any Minister can spend our money on what they want without we knowing what on, no wonder Cayman is in a sorrowful state.
These people have to go NOW!
… and Mr. Bush, all of our members promise to vote for you.
Ah na geen y plenty money f jes one wote man. Y ga get more good Christuns in dey like me det kin wote f me. Rememba a ga be caeful wid dees people money y na.
So wrong on so many levels. This place desperately needs to see a separation of church and state, and until that happens, shit like this will continue to hit the fan… SMH
Where else would we get the enduring ethical guidance that our churches continue to urge upon us?”
I guess that depends on which "Church" one goes to.
I can not help but not utter the sound words of the renown Benjamin Franklin, U.S. Statesman, Inventor, and Author in his letter to Dr. Price: "When religion is good, it will take care of itself. When it is not able to take care of itself [needing financial help], and God does not see fit to take care of it, so that it has to appeal to the civil power for support, it is evidence to my mind that its cause is a bad one."
This to say, how can these ministers in good faith, take the public's monies so as to protect themselves from a hurricane?! This is against the bedrock principles of the Separation of Church & State in the Cayman Islands! To me, for ministers to put their financial reliance on the government and use the people's funds, shows a different breed of corruption that is not only hypocritical and disgusting, but could well mean, down the road, the infringment of other people's religious rights in the Cayman Islands.
Of course, I affirm in a true and powerful God, the Source of all things great and small; and yes, I affirm in enduring ethical and bedrock principles amidst the changing times like man who has built his house upon a rock and the fool that built his on sifting sand. But, Mr. Premier, as far I know, from the conscience from where free thought, free speech, pure and undefiled morals arise, irrespective of where one is from, such spiritual things (not of this world) should be left entirely to private constribution, and not defiled by the governments treasury.
If the Spirit of God is really working like these ministers say and preach vehemently in their churches, then I can't see why God, during a hurricane or natural disaster, wouldn't see to the protection and security of His flock. Like the Good Book says in Pslams, "Blessed is he who abides under the shadow of the Almighty."
And the question is now asked, why do we need a Constitution with a Bill of Rights and freedom of religion therein, if we are seeing such acts from this current government in favor of certain religious groups?
Is that what they taught you in your Lodge meeting?
lol… your mind has went adrift. Why would you think that I am a Lodge man?
"This is against the bedrock principles of the Separation of Church & State in the Cayman Islands!".
There is no such "bedrock principle" in the Cayman Islands and never has been. There is also no such principle in the UK. That is an American principle and even in America there are Faith-Based partnerships. The do not offend the principle of freedom of religion.
Religion.
The greatest political tool of all time.
Always has been…always will be.
Gee… and I thought that title belonged to Mr. Bush.
George Bush/ McKeeva Bush, tomatos, TOMATOS
Mac Bush, the greatest political tool of all time
Now.. I'm not trying to stir up a storm but… I know a lot of people who 'go to church' but do I see the benefit of them receiving 'enduring ethical guidance'…? Ermmm.. No.!
Never mix Politics with Religion.. as true today as it's always been!
Another big pile of crap to the skies courtesy McKeeva Bush!
asbolute joke…. again more questions than answers…..
I would love to get a comment from the governor on this …but that won't happen…..
auditor general should investigate this asap…..
Jesus Christ!
Je$u$ Chri$t!
Je$u$ CI$hri$t!
Holely $hit!
When are people going to wake up and realise that organised religion is a devastating curse on humanity. The harm and suffering inflicted by churches and religions far outweighs any good they do. There is no magical being in the sky controlling your life! Take responsibility for yourself!
signed – Satan
Co-signed – God
Why do we need multi million dollar churches with tax payers money when crime is high and the level of spiritual maturity is at an all time low?
Because it buys votes, silly.
OMG….I am not a heathen but churches?????? Are these churches helping the people who lost their jobs, homes? Are these churhes compensating the civil servants? I am sure the civil servants would have appreciated their salaries not being cut then seeing the money going to churches. 20 Scholarships? That is great, but I think that number should have been more instead of giving it to the churches. The children are the future of the cayman islands, and as of now they have no future…..
The sad thing about it, is elections are right around the corner and the day after elections we are going to have the same crew in there!!!
This STINKS of vote buying – get the pastor on board and the congregation will follow. It is what everyone suspected about the Mac-Slush Fund. There needs to be a clear seperation between the church and government and this more than blurs any reasonable lines.
Mac has GOT TO GO NOW before he drives this country even further into ruin.
As for the churches, I fully support their causes, but understand the following:
They get ample funds from the congregations
They get funds from fundraising.
They get 0% duty on all church related goods.
They are more than taken care of.
On the other hand, if Mac wants to buy a few more votes he can wire me a small sum and I will praise him to my employees so they vote for him – or is that bribery and corruption?
Oh, that's right, Teflon-Mac could never fall to those charges… Time longa dan rope, my friend, and the rope is fast running out…
Took the words right out of my mouth. Votes bought and paid for.
Hallelujah.
How many of these churches were in West Bay and Cayman Brac? I bet it was all of them. We need proof that the breakdown he had given us is correct. Name the churches, don't embarrass the students by naming them. I would have thought that these gifts would have been publicised at the time, what's wrong with admitting you gave money to the Pines etc…. (if that is what really happened)?
Sorry – students too. Or didn't they have to compete in an open forum along with all the other deserving students looking for the same opportunity.
What a load of BULL
Churches???? Like they need anymore money! They get enough help from their members as is! How else do you think all the pastors live in million dollar homes and drive benz's. How about you help the people that really need the money! Then again…i guess u'll be getting plenty of votes which is what the plan is anyway.
There is a saying for such ministers, found in their book of books. Actually, Jesus made the statement: "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. Many will say to Me in that day, 'Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?' And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!'" – Matthew 7:21-23
So what's your book of books Libertarian? Illuminate us…please.