Property tax & VAT on table for TCI

| 06/11/2010

(TC Weekly news): VAT, land and property tax may be introduced in the Turks and Caicos Islands, which is still under direct British rule, with the start of a project following up on the controversial recommendations of a revenue study published early this year. According to Acting Governor Mark Capes, no decisions will be taken without consultation with the public, business community and consultative forum. Plans to introduce sales and property taxes to the TCI appeared a step closer this week after details of the project were leaked to the public. The furtive release of a presentation made by two economists to the Government sent dismay across the business community.

The 28-page document, dated October 18, is being widely viewed as paving the way for a string of largely unpopular new levies. It outlines methods for gathering relevant information and acknowledges the potential for pervasive opposition. In April, public sector chief Mark Capes said there were no plans for increased taxation for fear of further dampening the economy. His comments followed recommendations by economics expert Alan Roe, who assessed the TCI’s financial structure in February this year. However, this Thursday he released a statement that revealed improvements to TCIG’s tax administration system were being assessed.

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  1. whodatis says:

    I honestly wonder if you readers, voters and posters to this particular thread are proud of yourselves?

    Take a minute and honestly review the sentiments and opinions that have been expressed within this topic.

    The callous regard for overseas territories and its citizens is disgusting … and clearly the majority of you people (yep, I said it for you truly deserve it today) are standing firm as a collective in your stance.

    Tell me – why did you come to the Cayman Islands?

    Do you even like the people of the Cayman Islands?

    Do you consider the people of the Cayman Islands as "equal" to you?

    (Btw, if you have to take time to consider your answer to that question you have just answered it.)

    Considering your attitude to us OTC’s – would it have not been a better idea to have just remained in your home country?

    Why do you fight so adamantly against our immigration policies if you really do not care about the plight of the native people of this tiny country?

    Why is a particular group amongst the most demanding expats within our community – yet appear to be the ones that wish us ill-will the most?

    Are you simply jealous of the "Cayman" experience?

    Are you bitter?

    Finally – am I not therefore wise to take the average expat within certain circles with a grain of salt?

    (Do us all a favor will you? Just go home. Leave this beautiful island-nation in the sea. Return to whatever land you came from – you are obviously not happy here … why torture yourself any longer?)

    We have absolutely no use for individuals of your mindset – and heaven forbid my child ends up having to share this tiny land-space with one of your poisoned, reprehensible offspring.

    Yours truly,



    • Truth says:

      Ahh boo hoo

      You attack a nation of people and when the favour is returned you have a little hissy fit

      Grow up, I you can’t take it, the simply don’t give it out yourself.

      • whodatis says:

        @ Truth

        I have already addressed you in a post somewhere below this one.

        Enjoy my linked video – the stats and facts are quite impressive are they not?

        I simply state facts – however, many would prefer said facts and figures remain hidden from the light of day.

        Give it up buddy … your nations stance of superiority is a joke in 2010.

        Hey – I heard Cameron is on a trip on his knees as he pleads with the "China-men" … yep – welcome to the 21st century my friend.

    • Blousenskirt says:

      Is there something troubling you whodatis? Bless.

    • Anonymous says:

      Does anyone know if the Turks and Caicos Islands did very well as a Tax haven and a UK territory. Was their economy on the rise? Were they on their way up successfully  like the Cayman Islands when the UK declared them a N"o confidence and unfit government?" as an excuse for the UK takeover.

      If the Answer is ‘YES"

      Shall we take a look in the mirror to see who’s tail gating us too?

      Is too much spending and Police Corruption grounds for consideration for a UK takeover?

      Are we next?

      I want some serious answers please, no Bull!

  2. chad says:

    This was a legal case that could have been dealt with legally!

    The Premier could have been prosecuted. This is one of the main reasons why the United Nations General Assembly condemn the UK! It was because instead of them dealing with corruption like how they would in their own main-country, they instead, took advantage of the people of Turks and Caicos and altogether dissolved their government, and did away with their Constitution, closing down their Central Bank. Governor Wetherell dictates his orders as he please upon the inhabitants and hence "everyone" suffers for 1 man’s corruption.


    What should have been dealt with legally, has been dealt with by an invasion and trampling of the people’s democracy. Now we read how the Truks and Caicos economy is at an all time economic low, and the UK were forced to submit 10 million into the country to help boost it just some months ago.

    If you think I am telling you fairy tales, surf the internet and weigh my factual claims yourself. I challenge any who oppose what I say!

    This is very sad and I feel sorry for the TCI people!

    This is Colonialism!  There is no other name for it!

    This from the beginning had nothing to do with ridding the country of corruption!  The "special interest" had their eyes on TCI’s Treasury and TCI Bank… way before corruption allegations was brought against Premier Misick.

    I am British and I can tell you, I am sick of this crap! We have a country where we have more nobler people than this breed!

    • Pit Bull says:

      I doubt you are British born from the way you write.

      I am proud that the UK had the guts to do the right thing and step in.  Corruption of the extent in the TCI was like an advanced cancer and radical surgery was needed.

      These small territories are given great leeway in self-governance, probably too much.  But when that self-governance goes awry it is the UK’s right and obligation to step in and protect those in UK territory.


      • Anonymous says:

        Are the British trying  to force the Cayman Islands into direct taxation as well?

        This all smells very fishy. Recent proposals by government of talks on Direct Taxation etc,  .There seems to be a pattern here. Also corruption in government Police Enforcement,  Too much spending and need permission to borrow. Operation Investigation this and that…never ending.

        Is this the reason why our Governor is taking too long to speak to us regarding our cries and our woes about our disatisfaction with unemployment and other   criticisms of our present day government ?

        If the governoris not talkint to us about it, then is he talking to the UK about it!

        Is he waiting to MAKE ONE SPEECH that will notify us all of the UK takeover?

        He is troublingly QUIET and way too cool!


  3. Just Proclaimin' says:

    Caymanians, harken! Incline ears for your future is being foretold!

  4. Anonymous says:

    BEWARE! We are next.

    It was very concerning when the "Census" person came around. The first thing they asked was how many people in my apartment out back… excuse me? A small studio that was not visible, unless you were snooping around my property. When I questioned why this information was even necessary if no one was living there, I was told they were instructed in their “Census” training to “CHECK OUT PROPERTIES” and report how many units they had. I again explained that no one was there, so they needn’t worry about having to check out anyone else, but still they insisted on confirmation of how many units on the property.

    Why you might ask as I did. Well, not for our good folk at planning, no the census organization wants the information. It took me seconds to calculate 2+2 = property TAX!

    BEWARE! They are arming themselves, soon the ax gonna swing. Opps I forgot the T soon the "Tax" gonna swing!

  5. Anonymus says:

    So this is what all the people on the other topics wishing for direct rule from Britain want. Interesting.

  6. whodatis says:

    I don’t even know what reaction I was expecting in the first place.

    Tony Blair is a lying, cold-blooded war criminal who is directly responsible forthe lives of hundreds of thousands of innocent men, women and children. I wonder how many Brits will admit to that globally obvious FACT?

    But oh dear God forbid – Missick embezzled money (gasp!)!!

    (In the UK there is another multiple MP corruption money scandal (tax payer money used for 2nd homes, homes of "girlfriends", relative’s expenses etc.) every 12 months these days – and every person reading this post knows it!)

    Ever heard of "lobbyists" people? Do you people actually believe that "democracy" and elected officials are running and controlling the USA, EU and UK … in 2010?!

    Pompous, narcissistic, hypocritical bunch … grow a spine and wake up – you brainwashed drones.

    The moral standing of Britain is as high as the toilet rim today. The dirt is exposed and plain to see – and the longer its citizens go along with its brain-dead patriotism the further into depravity and corruption it will fall.

    What are YOU going to do about it?


    I figured as much – why start now huh?

    • Alan Nivia says:

      Apparently if you type the word "fact" in capital letters, a proposition automatically becomes true in the CNS universe and that is a FACT.

      I can never work out why whodatis is so angry, but my guess, over the weeks of reading his posts, is that his caveman-like attitude to women has something to do with it.  Of course he always rushes to tell us he is Cayman’s Mr. Luvva Luvva. Yeah!

    • Anonymous says:

      But oh dear God forbid – Missick embezzled money (gasp!)!!

      in this flippant remark are you saying this is ok?

      The moral standing of Britain is as high as the toilet rim today

      So where do the countries of the Caribbean stand?

      whodatis….. if you think you can justify embezzlement by constantly going on about the UK then your more stupid than I thought.

      Theft is theft !

      Accept it and get off your broken record soap box!

      • whodatis says:

        (Please tell me you are only pretending to be as stupid as you come across in your post.)

        My post was not meant to "justify" theft in the Caribbean – instead it was to highlight the gross hypocrisy within the acts of the UK as they broke down TCI government and flipped them back to direct rule.

        If this is the penalty for "theft" – then pray tell, what is the penalty for crimes against humanity and waging illegal wars as the UK has done?

        Do you get it now?

        • Truth says:

          Do you some fish to go with that big chip on your shoulder.

          If you hate the Uk so much why did you ever live there, and I hope the door hit you on the way out.

          You want hypocrisy try the phrase "Caymanian Worker"

          • whodatis says:

            @ Truth

            "You want hypocrisy try the phrase "Caymanian Worker"??!

            No – more like …

            YOU want hypocrisy try the phrase "British Worker"


            The gig is up my friend.

            Britain is in NO POSITION to dictate to any country on the merits of good governance.

            Sadly many of its citizens are hanging on to faded terrorism … excuse me – faded glory.

    • Anonymous says:

      Glad to see you are such an authority on world politics, but perhaps time to sober up for a few days.  Tony Blair left PM office in June 2007. 

  7. whodatis says:

    Re: Sun, 11/07/2010 – 13:25

    How I feel about Britain is immaterial to this issue.

    (By the way, do you have any thoughts on the UK’s actions in this news story? Or did you just want to voice your disapproval to my comment? Deflection much?)

    It is how Britain regards its colonies and "its citizens" therein that needs to be highlighted and understood by the people.

    Anyway, you and like-minded individuals would prefer we understand the true dynamics of this relationship after the inevitable damage has been done.

    Sorry buddy – but "momma Britain" has told on herself time and again throughout recent history.

    (You know, the fact that you cannot see (or most likely – refuse to see) how relevant and telling are the facts surrounding that particular issue demonstrates more than I need to know about your mindset. There are far too many like you in our midst as well.)

    Anyway – moving on to something that actual matters …

    I trust that the leadership of Cayman will add their voices of disapproval and disappointment to the developments in TCI. This is no time for rejoicing – for if we believe that our time for the freewheeled and crushing blow by way of Britain is not coming down the pipeline we are kidding ourselves.

    The colonial powers have toyed with the destinies of our regional neighbors for way too long now – if we fail to stand together, or at the very minimum express our support for our defenseless regional partners then we are no better than the administrative scum of Britain themselves.

  8. inside job says:

    those in the know (there are much fewer than people think) know that plans are being drawn up for income or payroll tax here in Cayman within the next 12 months.


    watch and learn.

    • Exodus says:

      Those in the know are about to discover the sound of exodus.First in a trickle (we didn’t needem’ anyway) Then in a cascade (oh sh*T,  what have we done!).  If you think the roll-over was the beginning of an exodus watch what happens with direct taxation..  Cayman will end up with an economy similar to like Swan Island’s (south of here)

      • Anonymous says:

        Nonsense.  You think people will be so indignant over a 5% payroll tax they would leave a perfectly good job and return to a country where the income tax is 50%, there’s no pension, crummy healthcare and no jobs?  Wake up and smell the coffee. 

        Work permit fees are payroll tax, plain and simple.  And they are killing the island.  The fund administrators are leaving in droves and the businesses that remain are paying more and more every year.  Small businesses are struggling to make ends meet and paying more and more in permit fees.  Meanwhile, most salaries are way higher than comparable jobs in other "western nations".

        Has Bermuda payroll tax increased?  Yes, the top rate has gone from 11.5% to 16% in 16 years since it was introduced, but fewer companies pay top rate.  Companies with a payroll less than $500k have seen their net rate GO DOWN over that time. 

        Compare that to Cayman work permit fees which have TREBLED in the last FIVE YEARS on every single company regardless of size and companies are not allowed to pass any of that on to employees, even if they could or wanted to.

        The law firms that control Cayman Finance killed the last payroll tax proposal because they are one of the main beneficiaries of a regressive corporate tax regime.  Instead, Cayman Finance recommended the government put up permit fees to levels which only its members could afford.  Payroll tax?  Work permit fee?  What the heck is the difference??

        Payroll tax is paid in installments instead of up front.

        Payroll tax can be progressive so smaller/new companies pay less and have some incentive and ability to grow.

        Payroll tax means everybody pays the same RATE no matter how much they earn and no matter how profitable the company is.  Instead, currently, the work permit fee for a financial controller is the same whether the employee earns $50,000 (small employer) or $150,000 (law firm).  That’s 30% of salary for the small employer and 10% for the law firm.

        Here’s the irony.

        If we had a "payroll tax" instead of a "work permit fee" even if employers did not want to pass any on, they would be able to advertise HIGHER salaries without paying a bean extra.  (Employees would be no worse off under this scenario.)

        Why?  Let’s say instead of a CI$12,000 work permit fee an accounting firm paid a 15% payroll tax and 7.5% was payable by the employee.  Say the current salary is CI$60,000.  The company can now advertise the job at CI$65,000 gross (have you ever seen a job advertising the NET salary?) AND it is saving CI$2,250.

        Of course, employers might decide to pass on some of the charge, aslong as they thought people wouldn’t leave and they could still find people to work on the net salary being offered.  And with 2,400 Caymanians looking for work, how difficult could that be?  And then they wouldn’t have any payroll tax to pay!

        The bottom line is this: stop freaking out about "payroll tax", we already have it. 


        • Anonymous says:

          Talk about Nonsense, try learning the facts before you criticise others (and I am not the original poster).

          Bermuda and other countries that have payroll tax have expanded that tax so that their citizens also pay – even on money that they pay themselves. For anyone that would actually like to have a discussion based on reality here is the link.

          Here is a quote from the Bermuda Tax office:

          Payroll Tax is charged under the authority of the Payroll Tax Act 1995 and the Payroll Tax Rates Act 1995. The tax is charged on every employer and self-employed person at the standard rate.

          The tax base consists of actual remuneration paid, given, or assessed by any employer or self-employed person to every employee or deemed employee. Remuneration includes any benefits derived by the employee/deemed employee or self-employed person as a result of his/her employment, whether paid in cash or in kind. The remuneration of a self-employed person or a deemed employee is the greater of his actual or notional remuneration.

          The reality is that payroll tax is also much more expensive to administer (that means that more of the money raised by the tax goes into wasted administrative cost).

          It would be much better to reform the existing system before introducing an even more wasteful system.

  9. whodatis says:

    Does this surprise anyone?

    Remember … and never forget – we are nothing but "Tarzans and Man Fridays" – as described by the head of the Foreign and Commonwealth Office (FCO).

    Our "mother" needs to be reported to the authorities for centuries of ongoing "child abuse".

    Perhaps if we were a bit more like the Falkland Islanders we could rest easy. Britain seems to take up full military arms in their defense rather than deceive, uproot, and displace.

    HISTORY has PROVEN to me time and again what is MY TRUE VALUE in the eyes of Britain. No cotton-candy wrapped words will ever convince me otherwise.

    Yet people wonder why I DISTRUST and have absolutely no love for Britain.

    Gotta be kidding me!

    Wake up Cayman – sometimes in life it matters not what one considers himself to be – but instead, how others regard you can make or break your destiny … if they have the POWER to do so.

    It is 2010 people, I for one would rather DIE on my FEET than LIVE on my KNEES.

    • Anonymous says:

      Oh dear Lord Jesus, whodatis, do us all a favour and stop your stupid dredging up again and again of your old "Tarzan and Man Friday" stuff. We get your point. You hate Britain. Fair enough. We know. You don’t need to keep reminding us. Try saying something new and original in your posts.

  10. Kmanite says:

    This is right where Cayman is headed:

    Questionable financing deals,

    double-dipping MLAs,

    inability to properly manage civil servants debts,

    no proper accounting for years,

    crippling civil service pension liability,

    out of control spending,

    declining revenues,

    direct liability to UK due to blatant human rights breaches…

    a XXXX Premier with a penchant for suspicious deals and a record of mismanagement of funds and involvement in the collapse of a local bank.

    Give em enough rope, let them hang themselves – the UK is thinking. Then when we step in, they will have no one to blame but their own.

    • The poroblem wid u says:

      The problem with you sonny boy is youse a PPM, tha wa wrong wid u. Eye-is frum ole bush and eye-is sure u memba sittin on ur porch an tellin me all about them PPMs and the dutty lil secrets them gots on us.

      Unna is gunna lern soon doh, Mark my wuds (no nah you Mark, I wazzin callin u, I was tellin dem fools yah who dey mama is, go back sleep bobo – hush hush ma boy, u look jes like uncle mackie onleh lil darkah)

  11. Anonymous says:

    Ever wonder why our Governor is so quiet. They are just giving us enough rope.

  12. ex-pat Eric says:

    Soon come to Cayman as well! I am assuming that will be part of Mac’s 90 days to success.

    Government’s are finding out that just like ordinary citizens, one cannot spend more $ than one brings home!

  13. Abaddon says:

    "martin" @ Sat, 11/06/2010 – 11:38.

    Could you explain where the UN condemn this? I doubt very much that they would because property taxation is a key part of their "sustainable development" initiative otherwise known as Agenda 21.

    The right to own property free and clear will be totally eliminated so that the UN will one day own the ground that you stand on.

    You can be assured that McKeeva Bush is on board with this and I categorically GUARANTEE that the question of property tax will become a hot item in Cayman within 4 months. (Bookmark this page. Next time, I will tell you how I know)

    Please do not go around with your ridiculous "good cop, bad cop" ploy. This might work in the movies, but not here.

    The UK is playing the bad cop and you want us to embrace the UN? Please find another rock.

    To my fellow Caymanians, stop burying your head in the sand and wake up before you get shafted.

    • martin says:

      @Abaddon (not verified)on Sat, 11/06/2010 – 16:19.

      Read for yourself!  I don’t have to give you tons of articles about this fact, these things are plain as day and your ratings worse of all, just show you how much ignorance there is pertaining to the relationship and history between the UK and the colonies: –

      How about reading this one below Abaddon?

      "On October 12, 2009, the United Kingdom announced an update and report describing its steps taken toward its newly formed government in Turks and Caicos (UK). The report enumerated measures to restore what the UK calls, "principles of good governance and sound financial management in the Turks and Caicos Islands."

      Slowly but surely, the world is learning of the news of the UK takeover of the Turks and Caicos Islands though it has been nearly one month since the "British Invasion".

      Many assume that since Turks and Caicos is an island territory of the UK, that UK had a legal right to take over governance of the islands. The UN recognised Turks and Caicos as a territory of the UK only under the condition of a partnering relationship between the two.

      The European Union, the United Nations and CARICOM (the Caribbean nation bloc), all condemn the UK’s action of terminating Turks and Caicos’ constitution and taking over the islands’ government.

      This week, the United Nations continued…

      Read more:

      Next time if you are going to refute me, please refute me with facts : )

      • Pauly Cicero says:

        I understand your reluctance to give tons of facts and I am certainly not asking for tons, but could you give us just one? The article you linked is a blog post i.e opinion, not fact. The UN article referenced in the blog post was a report of a committee of the General Assembly where Nicaragua and Bolivia mentioned the TCI situation in the context of orderly decolonisation and UK malfeasance. Hardly, by any way you want to spin it, a UN rebuke.

  14. partyanimal says:

    Iol… I love it!  These clowns!  After they decide for the people of TCI, at last minute without public review, they announce it to get their islandwide support!  Talk about democracy and transparency!  The UK dissappoint me – say one thing and do something else

  15. martin says:

    The people there are in bondage. Do you seriously think they have any say? Just because the FCO found corruption with their Premier Misick, doesn’t give them the right and justification to take over the islands treasury and dissolve their government! Moreover, to trample on their right to a democracy, election, referendum, and fair representation.

    Condemn by the UN, I too condemn this foolishness!  I can’t see how the United States are still partners with the UK when in their own backyard they are Dictators and treat the people of the colonies like they can’t think for themselves. Luckily all their Met teams and investigators that came here failed and loss their cases to determine corruption in the Cayman Islands.

    We will be watching and I can assure you one day the UN will step in, and even members of British Parliament who opposed the imperial act!

    • Anonymous says:

      To those giving the thumb down , I hope you know it could happen here.

      There is recorded history to support this. If you think they love us for our sake , think again. Just step over what they consider the proverbial line and you will see.