Dead man was tagged

| 22/07/2010

(CNS): The Emergency Communications and Electronic Monitoring Department has now confirmed wide speculation that the man shot and killed by a homeowner in the early hours of this morning, during an attempted burglary, was fitted with an electronic tagging device. The department stated that at the time of the incident the tracking device was showing the man was present at another location. The tag had clearly been removed but the department said it does not yet know how. Once the 911 centre realized that the person who had been shot was a client of theirs, police were sent to that location and recovered the tracking device, the department said. The dead man, who is Harryton Rivers (29), was on bail as a result of other criminal charges.

He was referred to the Electronic Monitoring Programme by the RCIPS on the 18 June 2010 under the provisions of the Bail Law. “The department has initiated a full investigation to determine under what circumstances the tracking device became detached from the client,” the monitoring department said in a statement.
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  1. Anonymous says:

    The Ankle monitors need to be charged as well.  If the person wearing it does not charge it, the battery wears down, the GPS no longer gives off a signal and and then there is no way to detect where they are going. Then the security center monitoring the device starts calling the person, the people s/he is supposed to be livingwith etc. By that time, the person is long gone from where they are supposed to be. Just an FYI…

  2. Anonymous says:

    What if …..

    What if the intruder did not end up dead for breaking and entering and somehow managed to get away ….. Mr. B. would have been at the station filing a report and identifying a man that according to "Police , 911 whomever " could not possibly be at Mr. B’s residence at the time of the incident because he was tagged!  The suspect would have walked free!  Luckily for us all – it did not happen that way.  

  3. Anonymous says:

    This whole tag business is a huge conflict of interest business and involves big people an investigation is needed and not let it be cover up like the rest of things going down in this place Mr Dugay is gone so the truth shall never be known Same old Cayman run the UK

    • Cayman Fisting says:

      Please expand on how the process of tracking criminals with tagging devices is a conflict of interest.

    • Anonymous says:

      I wonder if any crimes have been committed by persons who had removed their tags so they were taken off the suspect list for the crimes.  This situation may be widespread so unsolved crimes need to be revisited and the authorities should not automatically remove persons with tags simply because the device put them somewhere else.

    • Anonymous says:

      AHH we will miss Mr. Duguay for many, many years!

      Unlike so many others, he did his job very well.

       

       

  4. Anonymous says:

    fyi the reason they found the criminal is because immediately after the old man shot him he called the authorities to report the incident. the tag was useless because obviously they can be easily removed and left at the criminal’s home…I hope they change these tags now.

  5. Anonymous says:

    Being convicted did not help protect the community from him causing further harm, being incarcerated did not help, the electronic monitor did not help protect the community.  It seems only this man did!

    Let’s all thank him for helping the community as a whole.

    Only this man was able to stop him from commiting another crime.

     

    Thank you kind sir. Out of your unfortunate encounter came something good for the community as a whole.

  6. Anonymous says:

    I taught this man when he was a little boy. He was pathetic – very very slow. Trying to get him to learn anything was like pouring water into a bucket full of holes. He just couldn’t hack it. There were an awful lot of them like that and they are the ones whose names are cropping up in the news these days. They couldn’t/wouldn’t learn, often behaved outrageously but as adults booze and coke make them feel like men and they have no skills or willpower to earn money to buy these things so……………………….

    • Dennis Smith says:

      Doesn’t sound bright enough to figure out how to remove the monitor. That means that the entire criminal community knows how to remove them. How many others are running around with impunity? Is this why there is no reduction in crime?

      Better to bring them all in and start over.

      • Anonymous says:

        Interesting point, Dennis! The one thing they have and have learned to have from a very (ie from birth) early age of parental neglect is "street smarts".How to make a vulnerable- unloved- by- her parents girl feel good enough to do the deed at an early age which results in another unloved nuisance of a child. How to make a homemade gun. What kind of mask works in a robbery. How to remove an electronic tag. How to lie to parents then teachers then social workers then defence lawyers then parole boards etc.Then they try – sometimes successfully – to deceive the judges/magistrates. When they fail, they are genuinely totally bewildered because it has worked up to now and spend their time in Northward protesting how unfair life is.

        As their former teacher, I could say more but what would be the point? No one in the Portfolio or Education dept listened to us in the past (remember, there were no gangs/serious discipline problems) and so now we are all reaping the whirlwind.Ah so it go.

        • Anonymous says:

          I know someone’s child right now that to me, is a problem child in the school. One day the boy at the front of my yard "kiss his teeth" at me when I told him not to ride on my lawn. I went inside my house and brought out a belt to run off my lawn. The mother who lived across the road from me, saw me with the belt and came out and threaten me that if I ever put one finger on her son, she would do the unthinkable. I explained to her what had happen, yet she refused to stop making me look like a cold neighbor. I know her child is a very rude boy and worse, he is stubborn. He has problems at school. A teacher, I heard, spoke of him as being a slow child, hard to mold in behavior. He has a big ego and the mother sames to be the same way. One day, another neighbor said to me, look at this boy riding, note the toy gun in his pants pocket. He is only five and no one has taught him to carry a gun like that, but my neighbor look at me and said, "you see him, he is going to be a bad one. I can see it."  To this day, I am scared for these people, and that boy, what he is going to become.

          I conclude that some people and their children will not and can not change. The Bible speaks about sins passed on throughout generations. Already he is but 5 years old, just 5 and his ego and stubborness can be seen and I see is many times permitted by his mother.

          • Anonymous says:

             It is not your place to hit anyone’s child. Notify the parent firstly of the problem. If you are met with inaction, then notify the proper authorities. 

             

    • Anonymous says:

      destiny or fate, my friend

      That’s what that is

      I believe in it very much

      Some (no matter what you do) are proned to be ruled by their wants, desires, and ignorance whilst others are bent towards the light and spirit of God. And people reap what they so even from the last life time to the next. That is just my belief

    • Darwin says:

      You make good sense and I agree maybe we should put slow, dim witted people to death before they can drag the rest of us down or waste our valuable teaching time.

      • Anonymous says:

        …and pray, what should be the fate of incompetent, abusive teachers? I’m so happy they can’t ‘beat up’ anymore but their demeaning remarks to students … so despicable.  Poor kids don’t need to be subjected to destructive criticism resulting in more low self-esteem.  I hope the guilty teachers learn that this is wrong.  Children remember teachers – positive & negative!!

    • Anonymous says:

      Okay claiming to be a teacher and having such a negative view of students highlights some of the flaws that we have as a society.  If you are a teacher is it not your job to try and encourage all? Not just to claim "he can’t learn"  Is it not your job to find some way for this student to learn?  If you are not willing to encourage all students not matter what their IQ level is then you should not be teaching if that is what you do.  Find something else to do!

      • Anonymous says:

        ANON  Fri 9;14:

        "Having such a negative view of students"

        Your post shows your utter moronic ignorance of human beings and their ability to learn in ANY society. Cayman is not the only place where there are severely learning disabled students.Please, in your posts such as this one, don’t denigrate the efforts of many of us teachers who tried all sorts of methods to help this fellow and others when they were youngsters. You clearly are clueless and of course have no knowledge whatsoever about teaching. Nowhere did I say we did not try to find ways to try to help this and other students. I simply presented an opinion which I can assure you teachers will support.

        I am proud of what I have just written, calmly and reasonably, because I wanted to tell you in real blunt Caymanian terms what I really thought of your stupid post! And by the way, if you are trying to show how smart and knowledgeable about children you are, avoid the use of references to IQ. It’s out of date and somewhat discredited.

         

    • Anonymous says:

      They couldn’t/wouldn’t learn……? This mentality sucks.. Obviously they didn’t have the proper teachers.  This is where our education system failed – kids coming out of school and can’t read!!!.  Special needs were not dealt with correctly.  I knew some kids with learning disabilities who according to their teachers couldn’t/wouldn’t learn but guess what, these fortunate kids were sent abroad to schools for special needs and now they are back home as well educated/successful people. 

      Some teachers are not qualified/capable to teach special needs kids and I hope our education system does the right thing by addressing this serious inadequacy.  Get some qualified teachers

    • Anonymous says:

      I am very sad when I read this post. I have been an inner city school teacher for over 20 years and have NEVER felt any of these thoughts like you are feeling. I have also gone to 15 funerals for students/former students who have been killed by engaging in "criminal acts" and it "caught up to them" or they belonged to a gang and were gunned down.

      I can honestly say that they ALL had something to give to this world. They may not have been the brightest, but they had something to offer this world. I encouraged them while they were in school and I continued to encourage them when I saw them on the streets. I kept planting that seed of hope, kept working with them, filling out those job applications (even if they kept a job a month and then went back to gang activity- at least it was a month off the streets).

      There is no such thing as couldn’t/wouldn’t learn. Everyone can learn…maybe just at different speeds. As for wouldn’t learn…..it is hard to break bad habits….you must just try, try again. These "kids" need the extra mile, not for you (or us,as teachers/society) to give up on them.

      Believe me, I have had students who have been called "losers" go on to 4 yr. colleges and are now out making $60,000. plus per yr., own their own house, married, families, own their own companies……and these were the losers!! Had to work at the start, but look at the success stories…and there are alot of them!

       

       

    • on the real says:

      On a real note Anonymous 7/22/2010 – 16:57 – You are so pathetic! You disgust me! And it does not matter what kind of remark or how many thumbs down i get  for saying this but I have to tell you that you are PATHETIC! If any school hired you – they are pathetic as well. I guess you are just as bad because you MUST have lied your way through your teaching career. I know there are very challenging students that attend school but for God’s sake to talk about them like that just shows that you do your job just for the money – not to say you love teaching, at least not students. I dont think there is a school that has ever been where there were not challenging students. My God! Reading your post sickend me to the bone! When you say "a little boy" exactly what age is that? Well I am going to work with "little" Little boys and girls need training and if they are not getting it from home well then what do you expect?? NO it is not your duty to raise and train this child but didn’t your mom teach you if you are not going to be of any good dont be of any harm?!? Let me tell you this, I give wrong where there is wrong and right where there is right and the man that shot Harry – Mr. B, I give him NO WRONG! He did what I would do in this day and age, defend my self- and I am going to defend this young man on this topic only because I know that there are GOOD teachers out there and people like you make them look BAD! If i was to ever hear a teacher talk about my kid like that …. let me not finish! What sets your whole statement off is when you called him pathetic and then identify yourself as a teacher! WOW – come see parents how many of you had kids in his class and he thougth the same about them if they were a little too slow for his liking because I can tell the type of person he is just by this. You dont deserve to ever be called a teacher!

      • Anonymous says:

        15:28 I thank you! Thumbs up, to you! I work very hard as a teacher to treat each and every student like I would want my own family members treated in the school system/community. I try to find the positives and work to better what skills they may be lacking. It is a very difficult job each and every day, but one that I put my heart and soul into. I felt the earlier poster (another teacher) was very harmful in her words and hurts the outlook on our profession. I am glad others feel the same. Thank you for knowing that we are not all the same and there are some of us who work very hard to have your sons/daughters reach their potential in a caring, kind atmosphere.

        Of course, some of our students fall thru the cracks, but many, very many have very successful lives. Each one of them deserves a chance and when they fall, I believe it is our jobs, as teachers, to pick them up, dust them off, and get them started on their way to success again. If we want to just give up – write them off as "pathetic", then it is time for us to get out of our profession!   IMO

         

        • Anonymous says:

          The word "pathetic" means "deserving of pity" so I am at a loss to see why the original poster who taught Mr Rivers and described him as such when a little boy has endured such attacks. I didn’t interpret his/her post as being hostile to Mr Rivers or anyone else but instead was pointing out how these problems in our society go back into peoples’ childhod and are complicated and not easy for anyone – including good teachers – to fix.

  7. Man says:

    We need to debate the issue of firearm licenses. Now this homeowner had a license firearm. There are other persons with licenses firearms through the local Gun Club. My question then is: Why can’t the Government provide the necessary guidelines to allow more homeowners to successfully obtain a licenses firearm? My fear is that more people will obtain unlicensed firearms and we will find an increase in accidental shootings within homes, including children. With a well thought out and structured license program there can be safety training, written test, inspections, mandatory shooting practice sessions, etc. after all, do you really feel safe in your home anymore? Can we trust the RCIP to keep us safe? Are their sufficient laws to deter these criminals? What would you do, if someone broke, or, was caught by you breaking into your home at 2am? Do you have an exit strategy for you and your family? Should we need one? Are we entitled to protect our children?

    Comments?

    CNS this may be better ran as a story for comments. Sorry! I am not trying to tell you how to run your business! Just interested in the peoples comments!

  8. Anonymous says:

    Guess the headline should read

    Dead man was NOT tagged

    so much for the credibility of that program and those running it.

    • Anonymous says:

      Why don’t we wait until the investigation is done before we make a statement like that?  Always jumping to conclusions.  It is the criminal we need to be angry at for this whole thing happening in the first place!

      • Anonymous says:

        There isn’t a thing in the above mentioned statement (to which you refer) that would appear to be anything other than an opinion of the REPORTED facts and a reasonable conclusion of same. To what do you refer???

        • Anon says:

          Maybe with all the power outages we have been having lately, the criminal was able to get the tracking device off without any detection that it was being tampered with at the time. And maybe when the power came back on and the people in charge of monitoring the tracking devices saw that each criminal wearing one was in their designated place, so they just ASSUMED everything was A ok! Well as you can see, that was not the case. So now they need to go back over this entire process and maybe look for another source to monitor the tracking devices much much better than they did. And just maybe we won’t have another situation as this. Thank God that poor man was able to defend himself. What about the rest of us that are not so fortunate to be able to defend ourselves, our homes, our businesses and our families?

          • Anonymous says:

            Writer I am so glad you emphasized on the word ASSUME and you are so right, that’s what happens just about all the time.

            To those persons who do not know what the true meaning of this word is: ASS U ME (you have just made an ASS of U and ME)!

             

  9. One less says:

    Good Day Cayman,

    I said this day was coming.  Home owners you are entitle to apply for your gun licence and you have the right to protect your LIFE, your FAMILY and your PROPERTY.

    Criminals, please don’t come into my yard or my house.  My house may appear that no one is at home, but don’t let that fool you. 

    One Less

     

  10. anonymous says:

    I wonder, with the detachment of this device from your client, it would be fair to check  the others that wear these "Tracking Devices", because they could be playing the same games of being in two places at the same time, and out -smarting the Law Enforcers. It is mind boggling as to how safe is the pbublic with such  a device in  monitoring  our criminals that are on bail.

     

  11. Durrrr says:

    I think it’s safe to say the tags don’t work. This is at least the second incident when a tagged criminal has been where he shouldn’t be:

    http://www.compasscayman.com/caycompass/2010/03/26/Police–Gang-dispute-led-to-killings/

     

    "Royal Cayman Islands Police did not immediately report any arrests in connection with the shooting. However, there was a man arrested at the scene.

    According to police, that man was wearing an electronic monitoring device and was outside the area of his confinement. He had no direct relation to Thursday’s shooting, Mr. Baines said. "

    That one didn’t even take it off, and our genius police didn’t realise he was out!

    • Anonymous says:

      "our genius police didn’t even realise  he was out! "  I think you’ll find that the police department is not responsible for the monitoring – the emergency communications department is. But why would you let that apparently insignificant fact get in the way of a chance to complain about the RCIP.

      man shoots a man in his house, let’s blame the police

      man robs a store ,that must be the fault of the police too

      police arrest a man with a fake gun, police got it wrong

      police carry out road checks,police delayed my journey home

      elecronic monitoring apparently fails,who will we blame the police of course.

      and tonight on citn, womans cell phone doesn’t work mst be the fault of that darn police chopper!

      the police department is not responsible for all that’s not right in cayman…cayman society can take the blame for that.

      RCIP don’t give up there are many on these islands who support what you do.

       

       

       

       

       

       

       

      • anonymous says:

        The Police and 911 slack system has been ‘BUSTED"

        Why was this man not ‘PICKED UP" before committing thie crime?

        WELL,

        Were you really monitoring him and doing your jobs?

        Or were you all asleep again. I’m talking to 911 and the RCIP both of you entities are responsible!

  12. Anonymous says:

    I thought if the monitoring ankle device was removed by cutting it away or causing damage to remove it from one’s ankle, it would automatically send off an alarm to 911 Emergency Communications, who would subsequently inform the police to investigate the matter.

    I hope the CI Govt never got suckered into buying expensive electronic equipment that has serious flaws in it’s effectiveness.

     

     

     

     

    • Anonymous says:

      Someone that is responsible for these tracking devices please correct us, the naive public, if we are wrong!

      Is it true to say that if the tracking device is tampered with then the 911EC department would be immediately alerted to this fact so that they in turn can then contact the RCIP and the matter investigated immediately! This theory would only make sense, like in the movies.

      Or is it true to say now that again the Government just spent our hard earned monies in " a puss in a bag" investment! 

      Which is it?

      I am demanding that you, someone from Government answer us and make us aware of the truth because right now I am thinking that all of the crime being committed is by these individuals who have outsmarted the law and can continue to commit without being detected.

  13. Anonymous says:

    The plot thickens. 

  14. Anonymous says:

    Ta!  Just goes show these devices are not effective.  Make them do there time in Northward Prison and if there is not enough space, just tell Mckeeva we need a "ten story prison" to accomodate these criminals as they do not deserve a "bly" by being allowed back into society because they can be monitored – yeah right!

     

    • Anonymous says:

      heck, put em up in the new ‘hotel’ in the Brac 

    • visita says:

      I don’t think you’re to far off, on the "10 Story Prison"

      Could that be the reason the changes were made to the planning laws and the Preimya’s been talking to other Caribbean countries about a regional prison?

      Destination Medical & Destination Incarceration, just think of the income.

      Just a thought

  15. Anonymous says:

    This is LOONY!, what the heck, did i not see a big press release with these tags and how they are suppose to be tamper proof?, your telling me a criminal can remove them and continue there criminal activities?  I wonder now how many more criminals are doing the very same cause i have no fait in this system now.

    Did they buy these devices on eBay for a considerable discount?

    • Anonymous says:

      Maybe it is the fault of the people monitoring the alerts and not the tracking devices.

    • Anonymouse says:

      Maybe, but who benefitted from the discount. This sounds like another similiar deal to the helicopter.

    • Anonymous says:

      Is it the criminals removing these devices?

  16. Bozo the Clown says:

    OK then lets end the tagging scheme right now and round them all back into Northward.  This very bad apple has spoiled the barrel for the other bad apples.

  17. fabian says:

    emm

    this gives me the creeps…

    opens a pandora’s box of speculation

  18. Anonymous says:

    So, if he was tagged and was not found until he was shot at a private home on suspected burglary – does that not say something negative about the handling of the electronic equipment. If they can be removed that easily there must be some incompetence in the people who are in charge of this equipment. Will the authorities please check this out urgently!!! Why is money being wasted on this and paying people who cannot even monitor it properly??!!

    • Anonymous says:

      How do you know that the police didn’t respond? Unless he carried the bracelet with him after he cut it off, it would not have led the police to the burglary.

    • Anonymous says:

      Two questions come to my mind.

      1) How much did these electronic devices cost tax-payers?

      2) How much will it cost tax-payers for Govt. to bring in a Specialist to find out  what went wrong with the devices, why they could be removed by the wearers? 

      Should’nt it be the supplier of those devices pay for the investigation, and not tax-payers? Just a thought, and not to take away the seriousness of the matter.

       

  19. anon says:

    errrr why did the police not attend the location of the tag immediately as soon as this tag was removed – i believe an alarm goes off as soon as it is tampered with/ removed.

    as far as i am aware, the straps on these things are so thick and have wires running through which would no doubt take some time to cut through. the second it was tampered with the police should have responded.

    this whole event might have been prevented if the system was used as it should be.

    The criminal would be back behind bars and the homeowner would never had to go through this terrible ordeal.

    • Pending says:

      Turns out this is not the first time this has happened as I believe the suspect they arrested in the Damion Ming murder was also fitted with one of these devices.

      Clearly something doesn’t add up? If there is a system in place for these when they activate surely there must be someone monitoring these 24hrs day, or not, because they weren’t when both of these incidents happened. Sleeping on th job perhaps.. and bam, 2 murders.

    • Anonymous says:

      uuummmmm  they’d have to find him first 

  20. West Bayer says:

    And the signread:

    "Don’t beware of the dogs – BEWARE of the OWNER"!!

    The man did what he had to do!

    I feel pity for the owner who has to deal with this emotional scar and not that little punk who JUST got out on bail.  Like they say, "Yah can’t hear – y’ull feel"!

    • Anonymous says:

      I totally agree he was protecting his family and his home! I know that this must be a very difficult time for you but have faith and pray for strength.

      He was not invited there at that hour – less his "bracelet". What a waste of government $$$$$ once again.

      Someone had to take a stand – too many criminals are out there and committing these crimes and getting away with it!

      I think he should be given an MBB – Medal Badge of Bravery!!

  21. Ruination of Society says:

    When you live a life of crime, as this young man apparently did, what did everyone think the end result was going to be for this 29 yr old?  If an innocent home owner didn’t shot him, perhaps it would have been another person in his circle of friends.  

     
    I really hope parents think long and hard about how they raise their children. 
     
    Child neglect, not just child abuse,  =  the two main elements in the ruination of our society.  When are parents going to stand criminal charges for neglect?
     
    Clearly the way in which we are dealing with the rehab of offenders is not working.  When is this going to be fixed?
    • Anonymous says:

      "When are parents going to stand criminal charges for neglect?"

      He was 29 years old, not 13. 

      How old should the ‘child’ be and we keep charging the parents. 30?, 40?, 50?

      I’m 65, my son is 41.  Should I be charged if he commits a crime tomorrow? 

      • Anonymous says:

        I think the previous poster is referring to children in general, by saying all parents need to be more responsible for their children from an early age, to help prevent them from heading down the wrong road later on in life.

        Far too often children now a days are being neglected at an early age, and parent are not taking responsibily for their actions or lack their of as parenting.

  22. Anonymous says:

    So much for our safety with those out on bail huh? lol

    • Anonymous says:

      Some years ago my place was burgaled by a ‘person’ out on bail.  Would have been helpful if I had been shown a picture of that ‘person’ after recapture then I would know if I ever saw that ‘person’ out again!

  23. Man says:

    So this is a Career criminal with a tracking device being used as an alibi.

  24. Anonymous says:

    Wow that’s preety scary they can not keep track of them